Six 4 Sixty - Dr Box Special
Join Terry Cook and a panel of six esteemed driving instructors as they dive into crucial discussions about the psychological aspects of driving and the challenges faced by new drivers.
The conversation kicks off with an exploration of how instructors can help young learners build confidence and manage stress while navigating the roads. As they tackle a range of thought-provoking questions sent in by Dr. Elizabeth Box, the panel emphasizes the importance of relationship-building and understanding the unique needs of each learner.
The episode highlights the significant role of instructors in preparing students for real-world driving situations, particularly concerning risks associated with peer passengers and late-night driving. With a blend of humour and practical advice, this lively discussion aims to empower instructors and enhance the overall learning experience for new drivers.
For more information on The Instructor Podcast visit https://www.theinstructorpodcast.com/
In this edition of Six 4 Sixty, the questions were submitted by Dr Liz Box, and therefore pose a slightly different challenge to our ADI Avengers:
You can find the DriveFit resource mentioned in the show here.
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Takeaways:
- The psychological aspects of driving education are crucial for building confidence in students.
- Instructors should create an engaging environment that encourages students to ask questions.
- Maintaining a balance between teaching and allowing students to experience challenges is important.
- Parents can play a significant role in their teens' driving education by supporting practice.
- Instructors must stay informed about driving laws and regulations to educate their students effectively.
- Having a network of fellow instructors helps in sharing best practices and staying motivated.
Transcript
The instructor podcast with Terry Cook.
Emma Cottington:Talking with leaders, innovators, experts in game changers about what drives them.
Host:Welcome to Instructor podcast six for 60 edition.
Host:As always, I am your mediocre host, Terry Cook.
Host:I'm delighted to be even more delighted that you have chosen to listen because we are back with another edition of the six for 60, where I am joined by six of the best trainers in all the land.
Host:And they are Neil Whiteman, Phil Cowley, Emma Cottington, Chris Benstead, Lee Sperry, and Bob Martin.
Host:Now, I will ask a question, and then they will each have a maximum of 60 seconds to answer.
Host:But these aren't just any ordinary questions.
Host:Doctor Elizabeth Box was kind enough to send in seven questions and I've opted to ask them all.
Host:So a big thank you to doctor box for sending those in.
Host:But just before we begin, allow me to point you in the direction of the instructor podcast website.
Host:Over there you can find loads of free resources, you can find information on how to sign up for the instructor podcast premium, and you can find links to join the newsletter and WhatsApp channels.
Host:That's at www.theinstructorpodcast.com.
Host:but for now, let's get stuck into the show.
Moderator:So today I am joined by six of the best trainers in all the land, four of whom are paid up members of the instructor podcast premium, the other two.
Moderator:Well, whatever.
Moderator:Let's move on.
Moderator:As always, I like to start with a nice no context question, and I was struggling for one today, and then I realized who the first person I was going to ask a question to was.
Moderator:And that helped me, because today's question is, what score would you get if you took a part one test today?
Moderator:So, if you took a part one theory test today, what score would you get?
Moderator:So, Christ, Ben Steed, what score would you get if you took a part one theory test today?
Chris Benstead:One of the rare occasions I'm going to say that I'd get full marks, which is 100.
Moderator:Just to be clear, Neil, what score would you get?
Neil Whiteman:I think I'd get about 98.
Neil Whiteman:Just air on the safe side, Bob.
Bob Martin:100.
Bob Martin:And I can only say that really because I used to sit them all the time as head of training at.
Moderator:LDC, constantly test myself, no context questioned.
Phil Cowley:Phil, I'm going to go for 100 as well, because every time I've taken it, I've done 100.
Phil Cowley:So I'm going for that.
Moderator:Lee?
Lee Sperry:I think I get 100.
Lee Sperry:Unless I got some wrong.
Moderator:I think that math works out.
Emma Cottington:And, Emma, I'm going to go for 96.
Emma Cottington:I'm going to drop one in each.
Moderator:Okay.
Moderator:Intrigued by those answers, but let's move on to the proper ones, because hopefully I mentioned this in the intro to the show, but all these questions were sent in by doctor Elizabeth park.
Moderator:So actually, proper questions, not the normal nonsense that I do.
Moderator:And we're starting off with you, Chris.
Moderator:So the first question is going to be, how do you address the psychological aspects of driving with your students, such as building confidence and handling stress on the road?
Moderator:How do you address the psychological aspects of driving with your students, such as building confidence and handling stress on the road?
Moderator:Christopher?
Chris Benstead:They have to put up with me.
Chris Benstead:I think that's the bit where we've got to be there for a reason.
Chris Benstead:So at the beginning, you're telling what the pedals do, you talk all that boring stuff.
Chris Benstead:You're letting them get the experiential thing.
Chris Benstead:You just make sure they don't crash.
Chris Benstead:And then the development of that relationship is where I tried to support.
Chris Benstead:I tried to support that independence coming through and everything else.
Chris Benstead:But in doing so, I then try and what my business partner calls throw in a hand grenade.
Chris Benstead:And by doing that, if they can cope with me, then they can probably cope with all of the other stuff going on.
Chris Benstead:And then just make sure they get enough experience.
Chris Benstead:And there's never enough experience, so you just push the boat out and try and make it fun and interesting.
Chris Benstead:And I think there's a danger sometimes we make them too confident.
Chris Benstead:That's why they go and crash.
Moderator:I think that I would agree that if they can cope with you, they can cope with anything.
Moderator:And having done several podcasts with you, I'll attest to that.
Moderator:Neil, we're coming to you next.
Moderator:How would you address the psychological aspects of driving with your students, such as building confidence and handling stress on the road?
Neil Whiteman:Okay, so I'd just like to be myself with them and introduce them into the different levels of the GDE, to be quite honest.
Neil Whiteman:Keep putting different scenarios in there, see how they react to it.
Neil Whiteman:And if they start to get flustered, make it more difficult.
Neil Whiteman:And it's just generally just going down.
Neil Whiteman:The levels of the GDE start at the top and work down rather than working from the bottom up.
Neil Whiteman:And it's.
Neil Whiteman:It's just generally just making the situations for them, you know, background of a fireman.
Neil Whiteman:I love emergency vehicles, especially on lessons, when they really start to panic.
Neil Whiteman:So just putting things like that into it, that's all excellent.
Moderator:So we're coming to you next, Bob.
Bob Martin:I think having some of us have always tackled bits and pieces of this, you know, like when they've done something.
Bob Martin:Well, that was great, that.
Bob Martin:How would you do that in the dark?
Bob Martin:How would you do that in the rain?
Bob Martin:It's for me now it's about creating scenarios, you know, almost little case studies.
Bob Martin:Okay, so let's assume you pass your test, you're on the road, you're on your own, you've got your car, you've got your mates in the back, you want to drive fast.
Bob Martin:Tell me about it.
Bob Martin:How's that going to work?
Bob Martin:Tell me about the decision making process.
Bob Martin:What if your friends are trying to get you to go faster than you're comfortable with?
Bob Martin:What would you say?
Bob Martin:How would you handle that?
Bob Martin:What's your options?
Bob Martin:And get them to think through in these different scenarios, all the different options that are available to them and let them know that there isn't just one way of doing it.
Bob Martin:You haven't got to succumb to that pressure.
Bob Martin:And you're not going to look at dick if you don't.
Moderator:You're not going to look at dick if you don't.
Moderator:There we go.
Moderator:Never look a dick in the eye.
Moderator:Phil, same question to you.
Phil Cowley:You can't say that and then send it over to me.
Moderator:I wasn't looking at you.
Moderator:It's fine.
Phil Cowley:Be a good coach is my answer to this.
Phil Cowley:And so I would say, yeah, just become better at coaching.
Phil Cowley:Create an environment in the car where the pupils coming up with their own solutions and tackling these challenges in a way that they can continue learning post test.
Phil Cowley:I would also suggest for things like stress and anxiety, I tend to use quite a lot of the techniques from confident drivers and have conversations with pupils about how they're dealing with that stress and anxiety and breathing techniques.
Phil Cowley:I think also creating a teamwork environment in the car as well.
Phil Cowley:So the pupils are going to feel part of the team trying to create this driving.
Phil Cowley:And I think language is really important as well, how they.
Phil Cowley:How they describe what they're doing.
Phil Cowley:So not using words like anxious, scared, worried, and changing how they talk about the roundabout or anything like that.
Moderator:Okay, so how do you address psychological aspects of driving with your students, such as building confidence and handling stress on the road?
Lee Sperry:Lee, I think there's a growing discrimination in the industry towards young drivers.
Lee Sperry:I'm sure you've all seen it online, like, they're much more panicky these days.
Lee Sperry:They lack confidence.
Lee Sperry:They can't handle it like they used to.
Lee Sperry:Mommy's got a book, his lessons, blah, blah, blah.
Lee Sperry:And I don't think it's on I think if you think like that, you're probably in the wrong job.
Lee Sperry:And I don't think it should surprise anyone that the kids are like they are, because, you know, these are the COVID kids who couldn't go to school and couldn't develop social skills.
Lee Sperry:And if you look at the generation that raised our generation, you know, our parents produce resilient kids because they had to tolerate stuff like racism and misogyny and all that stuff.
Lee Sperry:But the parents of these 17 year old kids, now, they can't tolerate wheat.
Lee Sperry:So it's not a surprise.
Lee Sperry:But if we handle them, if we have to handle them differently to how we were handled, and we've got to find out how they like to learn and build them up brick by brick and not have much too much on their plate and empathize with them.
Moderator:All right, so, finally, Emma, same question to you.
Emma Cottington:I put my counselor hat on to answer this, I think.
Emma Cottington:So, for me, this is about me building the relationship from day one, because I want to know what the confidence and stress levels are like in life, not just in the car.
Emma Cottington:So I want to know what their map of the world is.
Emma Cottington:So I want to know what their map looks like before they've got to me.
Emma Cottington:So if I can figure out what their confidence levels are in other sort of scenarios in their life and what their stress levels are like in other sources of their life, then I can then apply that by tapping into their world.
Emma Cottington:And how does their world apply to driving?
Emma Cottington:What's that going to look like, and how would that affect the confidence and stress levels as an entrance level into driving, and then build on adding in the stress values from the GDE, adding in the nighttime driving, the driving in the rain, and things like that.
Emma Cottington:But I want to know about them first.
Moderator:There you go.
Moderator:Speaking of stress, I'm just in a.
Bob Martin:Note, Terry, just as a.
Bob Martin:Just a little sidebar here, that if you'd asked me that question 35 years ago as I entered the industry, I'd be saying, what a lot of new aid, new world, bloody tosh.
Bob Martin:There's bloody stupidity.
Bob Martin:I'm just here to teach people to drive.
Bob Martin:So if you're sat listening to this and you think that you need to evolve and become educated about it like.
Phil Cowley:I did, that was my b answer.
Moderator:Are you saying that new instructors and new trainers aren't as good as experienced trainers?
Bob Martin:No, I would never say something like that.
Moderator:I will also mention that.
Moderator:No pressure to you guys, but I will be sending this podcast to doctor box, and she'll be ranking you in all order of how well you did.
Moderator:So, you know, brilliant.
Moderator:I'll let you read into that what you will.
Moderator:So let's move on to question two.
Moderator:How do you coach your students to handle distractions while driving, such as mobile phones or passengers?
Moderator:How do you coach your students to handle distractions while driving, such as mobile phones or passengers?
Moderator:And we starting with you, Neil.
Neil Whiteman:Okay, so I love to get people in the car as well, extra people, mates, whatever, you know, put them in them sort of situations.
Neil Whiteman:I love putting a radio on and turning it up as loud as I possibly can and see how they can control that and just generally doing lots and lots of things like that.
Neil Whiteman:Really, it's.
Neil Whiteman:The more we can put into it, the more that more distractions that we can offer them is the better driver they're going to be or hopefully try and put in turning a radio up in a really complex junction, get some laughs at us and it gets quite airy at sometimes, but yeah, no, it's just putting things in that we would do normally or wouldn't do normally.
Moderator:No, just imagining Neil coming bombing past me on the last knobby snoop Dogg blaring out at windows as he going past.
Moderator:So, Bob, you're next.
Moderator:How do you coach your students handle distractions while driving?
Bob Martin:I think very similar to what Neil said, that they have to experience it because everybody thinks that that sort of stuff happens to somebody else.
Bob Martin:Although not me, I'm a good driver, me.
Bob Martin:That's these other idiots that get distracted and cause accidents.
Bob Martin:Everybody thinks that they're sort of immune to it.
Bob Martin:And it's not until you discover that it can happen to you that, you know, when you have, you know, you start riding motorbikes, you learn very quickly about distraction because it's much more important there because you can lose it a lot quicker.
Bob Martin:So I think it's.
Bob Martin:It's not just discussing it, but actually putting them in situations.
Bob Martin:So you've got to go somewhere safe and then start cracking the radio up, talking to them loads and loads and loads and then discuss afterwards, how were you feeling then?
Bob Martin:Did you start to feel a bit flustered?
Bob Martin:You looked a bit flustered, yeah.
Bob Martin:What other situations could you think of where that could happen to you?
Bob Martin:Because you've already seen it does happen because if you talk to them about it, perhaps happening to them would go, nah, not me, mate, no.
Moderator:Excellent.
Moderator:And same question, Phil.
Phil Cowley:Yeah, so I'm going to echo both of those answers in that you have to experience it.
Phil Cowley:Like, that's how we learn is by experiencing things same thing.
Phil Cowley:Get friends in the car, be their annoying passenger.
Phil Cowley:Like this.
Phil Cowley:Tunes, banging, boom, off we go.
Phil Cowley:I sometimes play like games where we're like naming movies through the Alphabet and because I guess their mind working and can be distracting again and we assess how that affected their driving.
Phil Cowley:I think also here I want to have conversations with them about post test.
Phil Cowley:How are they going to then avoid getting in those scenarios as well.
Phil Cowley:So I talked to them about marshmallow decisions, which I do not have time to explain.
Phil Cowley:Come and look at our workshop or google it and how they can make safe decisions that will prevent them getting into these scenarios.
Phil Cowley:So the biggest one I always use is putting your phone into driving mode is a marshmallow decision because it's making a safe decision now so that you don't have the temptation to make a poor decision later.
Moderator:Bill wins the award for first plug, first self promotion.
Moderator:Lee, same question, kind of what Bill.
Lee Sperry:Just said really in terms of like building habits.
Lee Sperry:And we can kind of build understanding through conversations as well, you know, primarily around risk.
Lee Sperry:And like Phil said, you know, when they first get in the car, I'd say, you know, put the, put their phones, both of your phones, your phone and their phone into the glovebox.
Lee Sperry:And at the end of the lesson, get the phones out and so they're out of arms reach and it's normal.
Lee Sperry:And you build that habit.
Lee Sperry:You know, it's so tempting to pick up your phone when you're sat at a light or in crawling traffic for them.
Lee Sperry:So like Phil said, if you utilize driving mode, they're not going to hear those tempting notifications, they're not going to see them because they're in the glove box.
Lee Sperry:And if you remove the temptation, you're going to remove the problem.
Lee Sperry:And I think sort of day to day, you know, we need to build in examples into conversations when discussing risks.
Lee Sperry:So, for example, if we're looking at, you know, someone that's breaking or slowing down without breaking, we can bring in that conversation about, you know, if the guy was behind you and he was on his phone, would he have seen that flash of red from you?
Lee Sperry:No, he wouldn't.
Lee Sperry:And it kind of kills the two birds.
Lee Sperry:With 1 st, I've had to stop.
Moderator:Putting my students phone in the glove box because I genuinely got sick of having to drive back to their house to give them their phone back.
Moderator:But a sensible person will be able to do it.
Moderator:Emma, how do you coach your students to handle distractions while driving?
Emma Cottington:Similar to what the other guys have said, exposure as much as possible.
Emma Cottington:Where we can, you know, and put that in place.
Emma Cottington:I'm lucky that I regularly have pdis out with us, so.
Emma Cottington:And they don't sit in the back of my car quiet.
Emma Cottington:I have conversations with the PDI why the learners are driving, so that they get used to people having a conversation in the car and things like that.
Emma Cottington:I suppose that could be done with like friends and family as well if you wanted to make that scenario.
Emma Cottington:The other thing as well I tend to do is get them driving independently from as early as possible.
Emma Cottington:So get them route planning from doing junctions lessons at the beginning, get them figuring out what the route is, get them following a route so that they're not reliant on you giving directions from early on.
Emma Cottington:And they're having to forward plan and think for themselves as well as getting the basics.
Emma Cottington:If they're doing it from the beginning, they're used to that level of building blocks from as early as possible, not waiting till they're ready to be independent and then do an independent drive.
Moderator:There's a lot of timers being filled there.
Moderator:I'm enjoying this one and we're coming to you, Chris, for the same question.
Chris Benstead:I think I'm probably going to go against what Lee said about putting things in the glove box and that sort of things because if you remove the opportunity for the distraction, then we're not allowing them to make those choices.
Chris Benstead:So I think we need to get the balance right.
Chris Benstead:And 99% of our pupils are going to be using their phone as a sat nav or they're going to be using it for listening to music.
Chris Benstead:They don't listen to the radio anymore.
Chris Benstead:Everyone listens to Spotify or other providers are available.
Chris Benstead:So I think actually keeping the distractions and then allowing it to become a learning moment is better than removing them.
Chris Benstead:So I think it's taking those opportunities.
Chris Benstead:I also do magic, so pick a card as we're going towards the junction is one of my favorites, that kind of thing, because it's those moments of oh, look at that.
Chris Benstead:When they need to be paying attention.
Moderator:None of you mentioned on the move high fives, which is I would have enjoyed.
Moderator:But I will also say no one listens to the radio.
Moderator:The Taylor Swift has her own radio station.
Moderator:When I offer that to my students, they bite my hand off and it's usually 30 year old blokes, which is amazing.
Moderator:But either way, let's move on to the next question.
Moderator:So on to question three.
Moderator:How can parents be active participants in their teens driver training?
Moderator:And what resources or practices can they utilize to provide optimal support.
Moderator:So how can parents be active participants in their teens driving?
Moderator:We're starting with you, Bob.
Bob Martin:It's something I've always encouraged and it's, it's useful for so many different reasons.
Bob Martin:One of the big things, if you're practicing for your standards, check because it puts pressure on you.
Bob Martin:But right from the get go, I'm a big believer in contracting.
Bob Martin:So we talk about, okay, who's involved in this?
Bob Martin:Are you going to practice with a woman, dad?
Bob Martin:Dad says when I've got the basics, he'll take me out.
Bob Martin:At LDC, they have a driving skilled workbook which was originally designed to help parents teach their kids to drive.
Bob Martin:So we use it for the instructors now.
Bob Martin:So it helps mom, dad, brother, sister, boyfriend, girlfriend, husband, wife to sit next to the person and know that they're not teaching them bad habits.
Bob Martin:So I encourage it big time.
Moderator:Excellent.
Moderator:And, Phil, how can parents be active participants in their teens driver training?
Phil Cowley:So I think obviously they can help with, like, private practice.
Phil Cowley:And I actually don't think I would advise them too much because I think they do a pretty decent job of letting them be independent and by potentially doing a bad job.
Phil Cowley:So I'm okay with that.
Phil Cowley:Just let them be independent and have some time in the car.
Phil Cowley:I am actually currently writing a parents guide for, for my driving skill.
Phil Cowley:But it's more about how do you keep them safe post test.
Phil Cowley:And I remember you had an episode on your podcast with Sharon and her daughter Caitlin had died.
Phil Cowley:And the thing that hit me was she said, if I knew now what I like, no, I wouldn't have let my daughter get in that car.
Phil Cowley:And that's what I want to write the book for, because I want them to know now what they need to know.
Phil Cowley:And so I think knowing, knowing the facts, knowing how they can help keep their kids safe post test, I think is part of our job to kind of educate parents.
Moderator:And for anyone listening, that was season seven, episode four, I think it was with Sharon Huddleston.
Moderator:So definitely go and check that out.
Phil Cowley:Don't know how you do that.
Moderator:I know the season.
Moderator:I don't always know the episode, but I've usually got a rough idea.
Moderator:Yeah, we're coming to you with the same question, Lee.
Lee Sperry:Yeah, I think it's a really good idea.
Lee Sperry:I think, like instructors, though, I think parents need to have the right mindset.
Lee Sperry:Like has just been said there parents might be thinking about.
Lee Sperry:It's all about the test.
Lee Sperry:They're thinking about test routes as well.
Lee Sperry:And we need to try and change that for it to work really well.
Lee Sperry:You know, as we know, they're already pretty good at doing our job, and they prove that during the lockdowns, they know how the individual ticks, and they don't have all our amazing wisdom, so they're going to naturally encourage them to reflect a bit more and kind of, you know, learn and learn through reflection.
Lee Sperry:I think we can help them with resources and kind of practice scenarios in between lessons.
Lee Sperry:But would we all sort of take to that?
Lee Sperry:I'm not sure.
Lee Sperry:I think a lot of instructors still think it's a threat to the business, which is really silly, but it would help create more experienced road users for when they pass the test.
Lee Sperry:And surely it can only be a good thing.
Moderator:Excellent.
Moderator:And, Emma, what are your thoughts?
Emma Cottington:Slightly echoing something Lee's just picked up on there?
Emma Cottington:Like them, parents know those kids the best, so they know that that child's map of the world, and that's where we should be starting from, is trying to figure that as much of that out as we can.
Emma Cottington:And I think they've got that.
Emma Cottington:I think our part in that is making the parents aware of resources that they might not be aware of.
Emma Cottington:Like, do they know about safe driving for life on the website?
Emma Cottington:Do they know about the honest truth?
Emma Cottington:Do they know that there's these things available to their child that's going to help them and their child when they're learning to drive?
Emma Cottington:And I think that's our responsibility to just cause we know it, not assume that they all know it as well because the chances are that they don't.
Emma Cottington:And I think that needs to be something that we're responsible for is, you know, actively going.
Emma Cottington:Here's a list of all of the things that we think are going to help while you're going to be on the road with your child to help them.
Moderator:Excellent.
Moderator:And, Chris, how can parents be active participants in their teens driver training?
Chris Benstead:We know that a lot of driving habits come from parents.
Chris Benstead:So the first thing I always encourage is mock testing the parents if they're going to take them out and do private practice, because you can pick up on the faults before they start, and that way you get an opportunity to educate and you can talk about the changes, about the way that we approach things differently and the differences in driving and that kind of thing.
Chris Benstead:I think that engagement is really important.
Chris Benstead:I also think, and it's also a business skill, and I was criticized on Facebook about it this week, is getting out the car and going and knocking on the door and actually talking to the parents in the first place because too many people just send a text message saying, I'm here.
Chris Benstead:We don't get enough exercise as it is.
Chris Benstead:So if you can't make your Adi walk back, then you should get out the car and go and knock on your pupil's door when you go and greet them because you might get an opportunity to have a chat.
Chris Benstead:We're happy to take the money but we won't always engage in the conversation.
Moderator:I think that's two one plugs now, Phil.
Moderator:Two Chris Warner.
Chris Benstead:That's free.
Moderator:It's still the old thing.
Moderator:Neil, what have you got to add?
Neil Whiteman:Yeah, I think along the same lines as most of the people.
Neil Whiteman:I encourage parents to sit in the back for numerous amount of reasons because one, they're going to learn a bit of theory as well.
Neil Whiteman:Probably down the line.
Neil Whiteman:They're going to learn tactics to help the pupil learn as well.
Neil Whiteman:But it also encourages them to get out there and take the kids out and give them that road experience because there's nothing worse than just 1 hour a week and doing nothing else in between, because that creates, I don't know, frustrations with a student sometimes, but it's just that two way street and I believe it needs to be a two way street whilst they're learning that they need encouragement from both of us, you know, the parents and the instructor.
Neil Whiteman:And like Chris said, it's good to get out and talk to the parents as well.
Moderator:Good stuff.
Moderator:And because it's doctor box that sent these questions in, I think I will take the opportunity to mention that one great resource you can share with your students and your parents is dryfit, which can be found on the RoadsafetyGB website.
Moderator:I'll include a link in the show notes, but let's move on to question four.
Moderator:This one is, in your opinion, what are the key qualities that make an excellent driving instructor and how can aspiring instructors develop these qualities?
Phil Cowley:Fill curiosity and a growth mindset is my answer.
Phil Cowley:I think curiosity from a point of view of so that you're nothing, closed minded and you're always curious about new things within the industry and new ways of working it out, but also so you're curious about your pupils and have that genuine belief that they have the answers within them and you're curious for their answers.
Phil Cowley:So I think curiosity's key and then that growth mindset is because you never stop learning and I think the day you decided to stop doing that, then you may as well quit.
Phil Cowley:So I think always having this mindset that we are trying to improve ourselves as we go through the industry.
Phil Cowley:So it isn't just about how many years you've done it, it's how well you've developed during those years.
Moderator:Excellent.
Moderator:So, Lee, in your opinion, what are the key qualities that make an excellent driving instructor, and how can aspiring instructors develop these qualities?
Lee Sperry:I think it's someone that, for a first and foremost, can see beyond the driving test and think beyond these minimum standards and think beyond the standards check and its triggers.
Lee Sperry:Someone who can develop attitudes and create thoughts as well as skills in people, someone that creates a learning environment, who can empower people to make their own decisions and reflect so they can learn.
Lee Sperry:A lot of people will say it's the DVSA's fault for the fact that we saw test focused, but it's just an excuse.
Lee Sperry:If you're going to go out of your way to build this ultimate driver, someone that thinks, someone that can make their own decisions when the pressure's on, then that's going to do wonders for the safety as well, because, you know, there'll be like has been said today, we're already talking about what if you're late for work, or what if you've got mates in the car and how would you deal with it?
Lee Sperry:And if we create that, we've got something far superior as an end product than that minimum standard test, which in turn will mean that you don't affect your triggers and you're not going to get a standards check.
Lee Sperry:So make today about your learner, not about.
Moderator:Are you making me happy, Emma?
Moderator:What other.
Moderator:Hold on, one question.
Moderator:Yes, Emma, in your opinion, what are the key qualities that make an excellent driving instructor and how can aspiring instructors develop these qualities?
Emma Cottington:I think the first thing is to recognise that you're both human, you and them.
Emma Cottington:I think there's got to be a level of empathy about what we do, recognizing that the human that we're dealing with is not the same as the one that we had the hour before or the one that's going to get in the car the hour after, and then our own sort of self awareness and regulation.
Emma Cottington:Humble enough to know that there's always people to learn from or places to learn from whilst you're developing, to strive to be the best yourself so that you can transfer those skills and have that relationship with the person who's in your car.
Emma Cottington:So, yeah, motivation and managing relationships.
Moderator:Excellent.
Chris Benstead:And Chris, I think that the most important thing is establishing what excellent is for you, because we've all got different views of it and most of the loudest voices in the industry tend to be the ones that are talking about skills for improving your pupils and developing them.
Chris Benstead:But it starts with you.
Chris Benstead:And there's a quote that I'm going to mess up, which is something about knowledge is knowing other people and wisdom is knowing yourself.
Chris Benstead:So I think if you start with that, figure out what you think excellent is and then look at, you know, be really reflective and try and figure out how to develop that and work towards it, that might change along the way.
Chris Benstead:And if it does, that's fine.
Chris Benstead:You can then change the direction.
Chris Benstead:So it's not wrong to make loads of money.
Chris Benstead:It's also not wrong to focus on road safety, decide what's right for you and then develop it to be the best that you can in that area and then you can expand other areas.
Moderator:Neil, in your opinion, what are the key qualities that make an excellent driving instructor, and how can aspiring instructors develop these qualities?
Neil Whiteman:Yeah, I'm thinking along the same sort of lines as the other guys, but I think it's creating an environment in the car where they're not scared to make a mistake.
Neil Whiteman:And once they've made a mistake, it's like Phil says, it's just be really, really curious and keep digging, digging and digging it down into what the error is and making them think about what that is.
Neil Whiteman:I very much like the fact that a growth mindset will transfer to the pupil as well and they'll be more inclined to learn more.
Neil Whiteman:And it's not being afraid to say that you're in the wrong sometimes because a lot of instructors are scared to admit they're in the wrong.
Neil Whiteman:And I think that shows the human side in the person if they're prepared to make a mistake and then admit they're wrong.
Moderator:Do you know what?
Moderator:I'm not putting the video out for this, but sometimes it's such lovely sometimes when one of you will say, all of the five of you starting all day long, I don't know, it's just such a nice moment when it happens.
Moderator:But yes, we're going to you, Bob, what are your thoughts on this?
Bob Martin:Well, I think you have to like people.
Bob Martin:You have to be interested in road safety and I think you have to be the sort of person who helps other people grow.
Bob Martin:Traditional instruction was telling people about all the mistakes they've made and that's belittling people.
Bob Martin:So we need to be able to create a relationship with our learners that's honest.
Bob Martin:We need to exhibit humility before those that we're trying to help.
Bob Martin:We've got to know more than those that we're trying to help.
Bob Martin:But showing constantly that, you know, more doesn't really help.
Bob Martin:And I think, above everything else, you must be able to have an unconditional, positive regard for the person sat next to you.
Bob Martin:And can I point out, I'm the only one who's not reached the timer yet.
Moderator:Well, some nod in there, but also you've got the bonus of making Chris shake his head at the start.
Moderator:So that's another win.
Moderator:But I'm going to chip in money, actually.
Moderator:And obviously, I don't usually use it to you guys, but I'm going to say, not throwing tantrums on Facebook and making sweeping outlandish statements that ostracize people and make them feel bad about themselves, that's never a good way to go.
Moderator:So I think we can avoid that.
Moderator:That is also a good thing.
Moderator:So let's move on to question five.
Moderator:So we'll be coming to you first for this one.
Moderator:Lee, what are the biggest challenges faced by driving instructors and how do we overcome them?
Lee Sperry:Well, without the obvious DVSA related ones, I'd say the biggest challenge is motivation, especially if you're, you know, if you're new in the industry and you've come from employment, you know, not having a boss to shout at you, not fearing being sacked, you can get complacent very quickly and you can believe your own hype, but who motivates them all to the amount of assessment we actually get versus the amount of hours we do is very low.
Lee Sperry:So we're on our own majority of the time, as much as we couldn't cry any harder about standards check.
Lee Sperry:But the reality is we're never watched, very rarely.
Lee Sperry:And that's why CPD is such a massive thing.
Lee Sperry:But if you don't keep learning, you don't improve, and then things can go stale.
Lee Sperry:I was the same.
Lee Sperry:I lost my motivation because I'd done this for 15 years.
Lee Sperry:But now when I teach, learners is a rarity.
Lee Sperry:I love it.
Lee Sperry:So, yeah, just keep trying new things.
Moderator:Emma, what are the biggest challenges faced by driving instructors and how do we overcome them?
Emma Cottington:I probably answer this in two words, and it's the noise.
Emma Cottington:There is so many people talking, so many people with opinions, so many people just talking at you.
Emma Cottington:I don't think I have ever had to use my breath work coaching and meditation coaching as much in my whole life as.
Emma Cottington:As this current day.
Emma Cottington:I think there is just so many people talking, and I think it's.
Emma Cottington:It's really hard to sift through what's right.
Emma Cottington:What's.
Emma Cottington:What's right for me, what's right for my pupils, what's right for my school.
Emma Cottington:And I'm just trying to stay grounded in those three things.
Emma Cottington:What's right for me, what's right for my students, what's right for my school, and that.
Emma Cottington:That's it.
Emma Cottington:But it's really, really difficult when you've got a lot of people talking and a lot of noise happening and like you've just said, a lot of people putting people down, not necessarily directly, but almost passively aggressively.
Emma Cottington:It's just noisy and.
Moderator:Yeah, and welcome to the show where there's six of you all sharing opinions, making a lot of noise.
Moderator:So go have a rest after this.
Moderator:Chris, what are your thoughts on.
Moderator:On the challenges faced by driving instructors?
Chris Benstead:I'm going to go with three words.
Chris Benstead:Loneliness, godliness and rigidness.
Chris Benstead:So I think loneliness, it can very easily be just you in a car.
Chris Benstead:So reach out and find a group of people, preferably not like minded, because it's better to be challenged and supported, but people that you get on with.
Chris Benstead:And my shaking of the head earlier was because I don't like people.
Chris Benstead:Sorry, Bob.
Chris Benstead:I like persons that's different.
Chris Benstead:Godliness is really easy to believe.
Chris Benstead:Your own B's.
Chris Benstead:So you can.
Chris Benstead:You can easily decide that everything you say is true and you could be spouting rubbish.
Chris Benstead:So again, get involved with other people and challenge it.
Chris Benstead:And rigidness is the issues from the likes of the waiting list and everything else.
Chris Benstead:When there's stuff that you cannot control and we haven't got the flexibility, having to find ways to work around that, they're the biggest challenges, I think, that we face as instructors.
Moderator:Sorry that you have to deal with people like me.
Moderator:Chris.
Moderator:Neil, same question.
Neil Whiteman:I think, you know, the normal ones, the challenges that DVSA throw in, but it's a lot of social media, like everybody's saying, there's comments out there that you don't really need to take any notice of.
Neil Whiteman:It's just be yourself and you overcome them challenges quite easily if you just be yourself and deal with what you do rather than worry about what everybody else does.
Neil Whiteman:Other than that, it's just like Chris says, it's lonely out there, but you find associations that can help you through or just share things and you can bounce off people and just use information the way you want to use it and not what others want to tell you.
Moderator:I like that end line there, that one.
Moderator:Good.
Moderator:I'm going to steal that and get it out on social media before this goes out.
Moderator:One of the biggest challenges faced by driving.
Moderator:How do we overcome them, Bob?
Bob Martin:I think echoing everything that's being said, referring back to something that Chris said about knowing yourself, there is such a lot of noise out there and there's more negativity than positivity.
Bob Martin:So I think a really.
Bob Martin:And it's especially difficult for brand new, qualified AdIs and people who are, you know, training to become.
Bob Martin:So I think an ideal thing to do is to think to yourself, well, if I could reinvent what I'm doing here, like, if I have anything I wanted, what would it look like for me?
Bob Martin:And make a list of this would be nirvana for me as an ADi and then look for resources that can help you to do that.
Bob Martin:In that mindset, then you're constantly looking for solutions, whereas social media just constantly throws up problems.
Bob Martin:15 left.
Moderator:I know you're on fire today, Bob.
Bob Martin:Because you upset me earlier.
Moderator:I'm going to message you after to get you to a podcast, but it'll be the shortest podcast ever.
Moderator:Now I'm going to have to leave it a few weeks.
Moderator:Phil, what have you got to add to this?
Moderator:Phil?
Phil Cowley:I think the thing that I get PDIs and AdIs asking me a lot about is managing pupil's expectations and people's wanting to go to test when they're not ready, whether that's because of the waiting list or just because of money.
Phil Cowley:So I think that a lot of people find that really challenging to manage their expectations and tell pupils they're not ready for test.
Phil Cowley:And the way I would overcome that is because I didn't like when I had a full diary of pupils, I never really had this issue as much.
Phil Cowley:And I think that's because you manage it from day one and you make it about being ready to drive, not ready to pass your driving test.
Phil Cowley:And if the pupil is constantly doing their own reflections and you're giving them honest feedback throughout the whole driving process, I do tend to find that doesn't happen at the end because it's not a surprise, you know, already, because you're having these conversations.
Phil Cowley:I think it can quite often come from when you're trying to be nice and you're saying, oh, it'll be all right, it'll be all right.
Phil Cowley:And then in the last minute you go, oh, actually, you know, you can't do your test.
Moderator:That was perfectly timed.
Moderator:I mean, I've loved all the monsters there.
Moderator:I thought they were great.
Moderator:And, yeah, I don't know what I'm going to do with that, but I think I need to find a way to collate all them together and get them out separately, because there's a lot of challenges being faced and I think you've covered a lot of them there.
Moderator:But I will also just mention, how cool is it that Doctor Elizabeth Box asked us that question about the challenges faced by driving instructors?
Moderator:Someone outside the industry asking.
Moderator:That, I think is quite good.
Moderator:But let's move on to the next question.
Moderator:So we'll be coming to you first with this, Emma, and it's how do you stay up to date with the latest driving laws and regulations?
Moderator:And how do you instruct jeepers?
Moderator:Try again.
Moderator:And how do you ensure your students are also informed?
Moderator:Now, doctor Box didn't add this bit on, but I will because the DVSA won't.
Emma Cottington:Well, I think that's a great place to start.
Emma Cottington:I think sometimes we've got to dig for this stuff, you know, it's not necessarily landing in your lap, is it?
Emma Cottington:You know, so we've got to sometimes dig with this stuff.
Emma Cottington:I think staying up to date with sort of networking, I think, in a way, we're a very lonely job.
Emma Cottington:So if we sole traders in particular.
Emma Cottington:So I think it's making sure that you've got a network of people around you, you know, where to go and dig what resources you need to be tapping into.
Emma Cottington:Are there certain subscriptions that you want to be aware of or certain emails that you do want to give out that you're going to want the emails and the information from, you know, collating that?
Emma Cottington:And then I think then making sure that your learners are aware of it is making sure that you're having those conversations, maybe using like a messaging service, our social media, so that you're actually then putting those things out to your students as well.
Moderator:Chris, how do you stay up to date with the latest driving laws and regulations and how do you ensure the students also stay informed?
Chris Benstead:You definitely need to make sure you're in touch with a trusted service of re sneezes that make sure the information is out there like the DITC.
Chris Benstead:I think I'm now winning.
Chris Benstead:So, no, I think the biggest thing is that it doesn't get shouted about well enough, it doesn't get communicated well enough.
Chris Benstead:So we have to make that effort to be in touch.
Chris Benstead:Don't get your information from tabloid headlines, Facebook or anyone that you happen to meet down the test centre.
Chris Benstead:Make sure it's factual.
Chris Benstead:Do your facts checking.
Chris Benstead:Don't just look at the line that's going to be in the highway code, look at the legislation and see what it actually means.
Chris Benstead:Not enough instructors do that.
Chris Benstead:And part of that is because it's not easy, it's not written very easily.
Chris Benstead:So if you can't do it yourself, then find someone that can.
Chris Benstead:The ditc dot co dot uk dot.
Moderator:But an instructor I met at the test center recently told me that you're more likely to fail on a Friday.
Moderator:Are you telling me this isn't like trusted information?
Chris Benstead:It would be statistically questionable.
Moderator:Neil, how long do you stay up to date?
Neil Whiteman:Loads and loads of CPD.
Neil Whiteman:I'm big believer in it.
Neil Whiteman:It needs to be mandatory.
Neil Whiteman:People need to look elsewhere than just the I way code and things like that.
Neil Whiteman:Look at stress, look at mindfulness, look at all different things and you can find some of that on the IMTD and it's all free, you know, on a Sunday morning.
Neil Whiteman:So it's look at different things and get yourself a plan.
Neil Whiteman:Make yourself a plan of where you're going to go through the year and how you're going to do it and what you need to look for that.
Neil Whiteman:There is loads of CPD out there and you don't have to pay for a lot of it, but like they say, just keep away from all the social media side.
Neil Whiteman:And Joe Bloggs told me this down the pub and whatever and all that.
Neil Whiteman:Yeah.
Neil Whiteman:It's just look for what you want and express it and then you can share it with your pupils.
Neil Whiteman:If you know it and understand it, you'll share it with your pupils quite easily as well then.
Moderator:Well, in the spirit of sharing important information, has the IMCD yet decided on their new badge?
Neil Whiteman:Not yet.
Moderator:Right, okay, keep us updated.
Moderator:My coil spring for that one.
Moderator:Who we got next?
Moderator:Bob?
Bob Martin:You can sign up to alerts from Gov dot UK.
Bob Martin:Be very careful.
Bob Martin: move away because you'll get: Bob Martin:Don't ask me how I know that.
Bob Martin:So you've got to just select what it is that you're after.
Bob Martin:So, driving legislation changes to driving law changes that the DBSA are going to make.
Bob Martin:So that's how I keep up to date with that.
Bob Martin:If you can't be bothered to do that, then as Chris says, the DITC will do it for you for not much money outside of that, staying up to date with other things, you know, what's new.
Bob Martin:And as Neil was saying, you know, have a.
Bob Martin:Have a look at the things that are available to you.
Bob Martin:Stuff that's outside or what's thought to be outside of our industry, you know, mindfulness coaching.
Bob Martin:Becoming a better coach makes him a better or better rounded person, I think.
Bob Martin:And I don't mean overweight.
Moderator:Oh, dear.
Neil Whiteman:Right.
Moderator:Come pause myself.
Moderator:Phil, go on.
Phil Cowley:I'm going to give another shout out to the DITC and if in doubt, I just message Chris saying what's going on.
Phil Cowley:I think also, I can't believe no one's not mentioned this, but also listen to the green room once a month because all the news is on there.
Phil Cowley:So they're my main reason ways to get the news.
Phil Cowley:I then would suggest that you should be posting this out to your learners on Facebook or resources via apps that you might have and so kind of like spreading the word.
Phil Cowley:I also do weekly meetings with my driving school team and so that they're up to date and then they can spread the word with their pupils.
Phil Cowley:So, yeah, go listen to the green room.
Moderator:If only there was a regular contributor who had had 60 seconds to talk about ways they could discover this stuff.
Moderator:Although to be fair, we did spend about ten minutes last night talking about my dating life.
Moderator:So, you know, it's not always the most relevant news.
Moderator:Lee, how do you stay up to date?
Moderator:I think that we are having that problem again of Lee not being able to spread the relevant information because.
Lee Sperry:Can you start my clock again?
Moderator:Can I start your what again?
Moderator:Right, yeah.
Lee Sperry:Right.
Lee Sperry:Thank you.
Lee Sperry:Yeah.
Lee Sperry:I'm the classic example of someone that felt, you know, stood still for years and then fell behind to the point where I nearly lost my job.
Lee Sperry:And it's that self employment mindset again.
Lee Sperry:You know, no one is responsible for making sure you keep up to date with the driving laws and regulations.
Lee Sperry:So it's really important to keep moving forward when it comes to your own development.
Lee Sperry:Traditionally, you know, you'd have to buy the latest publications and read them to stay abreast of like changing laws and stuff.
Lee Sperry:But now it's all at your fingertips, really, like the instructor podcast and other such platforms.
Lee Sperry:Unfortunately, you know, we've also got online, which, you know, like Emma said, is just noise.
Lee Sperry:And I think a lot of good stuff is lost in amongst all the crap and it creates a lot of sticking points.
Lee Sperry:But the proper information is out there.
Lee Sperry:You've just got to find the time to find it and have the drive to want to keep improving.
Lee Sperry:We've got a brand new Adi called Gary Thomas and he is the epitome of this right beginning.
Lee Sperry:And we talk a lot about a minute.
Moderator:You got about a minute and 20.
Moderator:You didn't speak for 1st.
Moderator:20.
Moderator:I.
Moderator:You know what, I will take a moment to say the DITC is the best communicator information out there most of the time.
Moderator:But if you want quick and easy access to short buy information, the instructor podcast WhatsApp channel is quite useful for that.
Moderator:But we have got a bonus question today because Octol is box sent in seven.
Moderator:The problem I've got with this 7th one is it's quite long and you've already heard me butcher a couple of short ones, so allow me to try and read this question out.
Moderator:But it's only going to get read once.
Moderator:I can't do it twice.
Moderator:Right, so no pressure.
Moderator:Oh, here we go.
Moderator:In the absence of a graduated driver licensing system, how do you ensure that young learners are fully aware of the risks associated with carrying peer age passengers and driving late night during the early months of their independent driving post test?
Moderator:And what specific role do you think that driving instructors play in educating and preparing students for these risk situations?
Moderator:I almost got that right, but we'll go with it.
Moderator:I'm not reading it again.
Moderator:Chris, you're up.
Chris Benstead:I'm still processing.
Chris Benstead:I think we kind of covered this earlier, didn't we, by the how do you develop their confidence?
Chris Benstead:How do you challenge things, all of those different areas?
Chris Benstead:It was across a couple of different questions.
Chris Benstead:The best thing we could do is bringing bring in GDL, but of some kind, a proper GDL.
Chris Benstead:It's one of those things that just make sense.
Chris Benstead:How do we address it otherwise?
Chris Benstead:We can work with parents to encourage a contract based system where if they're going to allow use of the car, there's rules and regulations involved in that.
Chris Benstead:We can encourage restrictions so they don't have peer passengers in the car.
Chris Benstead:We can make the choices ourselves, we don't have to have it legislated.
Chris Benstead:And insurance companies, if they could get on board better, if people do something wrong, send them back to us and we can work with them.
Chris Benstead:That answered the question, because it was a challenging one.
Moderator:I think so.
Moderator:And if anyone needs a question again, please tell me, but I'm not going to do it voluntarily.
Moderator:Neil, same question, unless you want it again.
Neil Whiteman:I think we've covered it quite well already, to be quite honest, with distractions and everything else.
Neil Whiteman:It's quite a touchy subject, but a lot of people don't like it.
Neil Whiteman:But it's all about working towards that post test, isn't it?
Neil Whiteman:And doing what we can to create that sort of atmosphere after they pass the test.
Neil Whiteman:And we can only keep trying.
Neil Whiteman:As driving instructors, we can only keep trying to involve that until they bring in Jerry GDL, who knows?
Neil Whiteman:But we can do what we can do and encourage what we can encourage.
Neil Whiteman:Bob.
Bob Martin:It's a tricky one, isn't it?
Bob Martin:Because even if you bring in GDL, you know, the graduated driving licenses, people will find ways around stuff.
Bob Martin:You know, they run an experiment in Australia where they said that kids had to have 200 hours with their parents and the parents were just signing the hours off without doing it.
Bob Martin:So it's a combination of a lot of the answers we've given.
Bob Martin:We need the parents working with us as a team and we need to talk about decision making and have that as the core really of what were doing.
Bob Martin:If this happened, what would you do?
Bob Martin:Okay, youre driving at night.
Bob Martin:What do you think your chances of having an accident are compared to driving through the day?
Bob Martin:Driving on a motorway?
Bob Martin:What types of roads create the biggest risk?
Bob Martin:So we need them to be risk aware, not risk averse, but aware of the risk and able to, I think Lou said, didnt she, ages ago about she wants her students to choose to drive badly, to be able to choose to have the nous to actually work it out.
Bob Martin:And that's the secret, I think, rather than legislation.
Bob Martin:We don't have everybody on board and get the parents on board, damn it.
Bob Martin:Thinking about that woman who said, if I'd known now what I knew that I'd known then what I know now.
Bob Martin:So maybe that's partly our job too.
Moderator:Excellent.
Phil Cowley:And Phil, so the honest truth app is my answer to this.
Phil Cowley:I would suggest that all of those things that you that are in within that the GDL are also there within the honest truth app, so you can enable you to have those sort of, kind of frank conversations with your pupils.
Phil Cowley:Get the parents involved in those as well.
Phil Cowley:Let the parents see the honest truth app and see what we're talking to their kids about.
Phil Cowley:So I think that's, yeah, definitely using the honest truth app within your lessons.
Phil Cowley:I think, again, social media, I'm regularly posting about road safety stuff and so that maybe parents or other drivers can see that just sort of kind of helping them understand their responsibilities.
Phil Cowley:I think the my car, my rules from honest truth as well, again, is sort of getting them to think about how am I going to be safe after I get in the car.
Phil Cowley:And I've got 6 seconds left.
Phil Cowley:So I'd like to thank Terry for giving us the questions a month in advance so we could read it as many times as we wanted to and.
Moderator:Not making me say it as many times as you want me to, which is helpful, but I'm glad you said that about social media, actually.
Moderator:I don't normally chip in with this, but I think it's a difference between helping a person and helping people.
Moderator:And you might not help everyone, but you might be able to help someone.
Moderator:So, Lee, your turn.
Lee Sperry:I think the GDL is something that would be quite difficult to police, and I think people will find a way of getting around it.
Lee Sperry:Like Bob suggested, I think from our end, it's really important that we try to create these right attitudes, because if we think right, we're going to drive right.
Lee Sperry:But the ones that are in danger are the ones that don't get these conversations when they're learning to drive.
Lee Sperry:So they don't have these thoughts and they haven't had these scenarios put to them when they were learning.
Lee Sperry:That comes down to us being kind of test focused again.
Lee Sperry:So we need to take every opportunity to relate on road scenarios to real life peer pressure, alcohol use and everything.
Lee Sperry:And we need to think how these factors can change how we feel inside when we're on our own.
Lee Sperry:But there'll always be dickheads who do dickhead things in cars, but we have to try and minimize that risk.
Moderator:Excellent.
Moderator:Last but by no means least, Emma Cottington.
Emma Cottington:I think the biggest thing for me when we have these conversations and we're tackling this stuff is that we need to forget that we're the expert.
Emma Cottington:We need to stop talking at them because we know that that doesn't work.
Emma Cottington:We know that the scare tactics doesn't work.
Emma Cottington:So I think for me, this is about exposure.
Emma Cottington:Have conversations that they're leading.
Emma Cottington:You know, what.
Emma Cottington:What is your understanding of, like, alcohol?
Emma Cottington:What's your understanding of driving at night?
Emma Cottington:You know, do you know what the risks are?
Emma Cottington:And just not talk at them, but have conversations, get what their opinions are and start mapping it to the world.
Emma Cottington:What's this?
Emma Cottington:What is this in their real life?
Emma Cottington:What does that look like?
Emma Cottington:And then, other than that, it's the same as what some of the others have said online presence.
Emma Cottington:One of the things I tend to do is check in with them after six weeks, once they've passed, and then again at three months, and just see whether there's anything else I can help with.
Moderator:Scur tactics.
Moderator:Does anybody want an additional 60 seconds to come back on anything we've spoken about today or just to throw abuse at anyone?
Emma Cottington:Seconds for that.
Bob Martin:An interesting debate evolving on Facebook at the minute about whether we should allow situations to develop or whether we should have been in earlier.
Bob Martin:And I think sometimes as trainers, we get kind of test focused, even though we might think, well, not what's everybody's thoughts on that?
Bob Martin:Would you let it happen and then reflect or would you always jump in.
Moderator:Beforehand, always coming back to Bob first.
Phil Cowley:On that depends how dangerous it is.
Emma Cottington:I would say, yeah, that would be my thoughts as well.
Emma Cottington:It would depend on the risk factor.
Emma Cottington:But I would be aiming to not get involved for as long as possible because I think experience is learning.
Emma Cottington:So that's where I would be going with it, unless it was a danger.
Bob Martin:I mean, I always take the line that experience is far better at teaching than I am, but I wouldn't let it evolve on a standards check or an audit.
Chris Benstead:Equally perceived risk needs to be taken into account because you might feel that it's perfectly safe while you're in the car, but your reputation could be being trashed by everybody else's perception of the fact you don't know what you're doing.
Phil Cowley:So can I tell a quick story that Lee said something that triggered.
Phil Cowley:So Lee said about he really now enjoys going back to teaching learners occasionally.
Phil Cowley:So I had the same feeling this year.
Phil Cowley:I stopped in January and I went back this week.
Phil Cowley:I'm doing two learners on a Monday just to kind of keep my eye in and also so people can come and sit in the back of my lessons.
Phil Cowley:So did my first lesson on Monday.
Phil Cowley:Thought it went brilliantly.
Phil Cowley:Challenging people that one of my instructors struggled with.
Phil Cowley:Great lesson.
Phil Cowley:And then today they messaged saying, yeah, I don't want to do driving lessons anymore.
Phil Cowley:So clearly wasn't that good.
Phil Cowley:I'm zero for zero right now.
Phil Cowley:Might go back to training instructors.
Lee Sperry:Bill, do you find that you're now better at doing the job than you were before you start?
Phil Cowley:100%.
Phil Cowley:Yeah.
Lee Sperry:Yeah.
Lee Sperry:I found that, like, it's just I was kind of nervous about it because I thought, I've not done it for a while, but afterwards I thought I've actually done a really good job.
Lee Sperry:And it's, you know, it's like something that Bob said to me a long time ago.
Lee Sperry:It's like if you're, you'll always get better at teaching it if you teach it to other people.
Lee Sperry:That's something that I found.
Lee Sperry:I was pretty nervous about it, but it went really well.
Moderator:I like it.
Chris Benstead:Can I still one last thing, because I didn't mention it because all the questions were very practically focused.
Chris Benstead:But I think one of the biggest areas that we could improve people's understanding of the psychological side of things is actually to have decent theory training in classroom, whether that be online or not where we look at those factors in that environment and then we take it into the car similar to the french model or the scandinavian models, where we actually engage with that side of things better.
Chris Benstead:But it's what can we do in the environment we've got at the moment.
Chris Benstead:But in the future, hopefully that will change.
Moderator:Maybe we need to start doing a post show ten minutes after this where we record a little more than ten minutes and just talk about stuff, which could be interesting.
Moderator:But I want to give you guys the opportunity to tell us why you're awesome and where people can find you.
Moderator:Phil, you've had pretty practice, at least throughout the last hour.
Moderator:But either way, Chris, why are you awesome and where can people find you?
Chris Benstead:I'm awesome because no one seems to know what I do, despite the fact I seem to be shouting about it all the time.
Chris Benstead:And then I talk to people and they go, I didn't know you did that.
Chris Benstead:I train driving instructors.
Chris Benstead:I'll do a lesson on pretty much anything if you want me to.
Chris Benstead:I just don't particularly like the trainer hat, so I don't shout about it a lot.
Chris Benstead:So if you want to find out what I can do to help you, I'm a qualified business coach, I'm an audit trainer, whatever that means.
Chris Benstead:And if you are interested in developing different skill sets, then I'm one of the people to get in touch with.
Chris Benstead:There's others in the room.
Chris Benstead:So theory test explained is the best place to find me because then you can check that out at the same time.
Moderator:Do for me, Neil, why are you awesome and where can people find you?
Neil Whiteman:I'm awesome because I'm me and people buy people.
Neil Whiteman:So hopefully people buy me because I'm awesome.
Neil Whiteman:Yeah, they can find me at why two learn driver training.
Neil Whiteman:They can find me on the IMTD published authors everybody knows, but they can find me through that on Amazon as well.
Neil Whiteman:So yeah, that's where they can find me.
Moderator:What's the book called?
Neil Whiteman:Untwist in the road to success.
Moderator:Excellent.
Moderator:Right, Bob, why are you awesome?
Moderator:Where can people find you?
Bob Martin:As ever, I'm awesome because my mum said I was and you can find me at clientcenteredlearning dot co dot Uk.
Bob Martin:Boblientcenteredlearning dot co dot UK is my email address.
Moderator:Excellent.
Moderator:And Phil, why are you awesome?
Moderator:Where can people find you?
Phil Cowley:I'm awesome because I genuinely care about helping instructors become better and I.
Phil Cowley:I also felt because I do it in a positive manner and try to inspire them rather than put people down and I think you can find us@inspireinstructuretraining.com with our membership.
Phil Cowley:We also have two workshops coming up, both online and we are taking our in person workshop online.
Phil Cowley:Our we're only human workshop on the 6 November, so they'll be all online.
Phil Cowley:Particularly proud of that one.
Phil Cowley:And the fact that we don't mention the standards check all part three app all and then the complete opposite of that one we are doing on nine and a half simple steps to pasture part three in which we will be mentioning the part three and the standards check all of the time on the 14 October.
Moderator:How many simple steps?
Phil Cowley:Nine and a half on that film.
Moderator:Nine and a half.
Chris Benstead:Nine and a half yards.
Lee Sperry:Was it not nine and a half men or is that something else?
Moderator:No, I think I'm thinking nine and a half.
Moderator:Your collection.
Phil Cowley:I can't be accused anymore of stealing other people's names when I use the night.
Phil Cowley:I'm not allowed to use numbers or words.
Moderator:You've stolen the nine and a half weeks title and combined it with simple steps.
Lee Sperry:Nine and a half weeks.
Lee Sperry:That's what I was.
Phil Cowley:Yeah, yeah.
Moderator:Kim Basinger.
Bob Martin:Correct.
Bob Martin:Mickey Rock.
Moderator:If you can wing somewhere there, then I'll attend to Lee.
Moderator:Why are you awesome and what do you have to offer?
Moderator:Where can people find you?
Lee Sperry:God, I hate this question.
Lee Sperry:I'm awesome because I've got a nasty habit of making what seems quite complicated to everyone else seem quite simple.
Lee Sperry:So if you want me to help you do that, then let me know.
Lee Sperry:I do instructor training primarily.
Lee Sperry:I can help people overcome their woes for standard check and part three, especially if you want me to help you, make you a good instructor, I can do that.
Lee Sperry:It's much better to be a big man with a small ego than a small little man with a big ego.
Lee Sperry:So if you want me to help you do that, then I can help you do that and you can find me at adi doctor dot co dot uk or pDI doctor dot co dot uk.
Moderator:I think I'm still trying to work out the ego thing there.
Moderator:Either way, Emma, why are you awesome?
Moderator:Where can people find you?
Emma Cottington:I am awesome because I am human.
Emma Cottington:And if you approach me for any help, I will treat you as a human.
Emma Cottington:I'm not going to come with knowing all the answers because I definitely don't.
Emma Cottington:But I will help you find out who you are and that'll help you find out who your learners are and help you progress in your job, in that respect, building human relationships.
Emma Cottington:And you will find me.
Emma Cottington:And everything I do, I have now got a link tree, which is linktree.com forward slash emmacatinton one.
Moderator:And you can find links for all that stuff that everyone said in the show notes, including links for Dodge was a box and dry fit and other stuff that's been mentioned today that I can't remember.
Moderator:So all that's left for me today is a big thank you to you guys for joining me, as always on this six or seven for 60 today, potentially.
Moderator:And a big thank you to you guys for listening.
Moderator:And let's just keep raising standards.
Emma Cottington:The instructor podcast with Terry Cook, talking with leaders, innovators, experts and game changers about what drives them.
