Six 4 Sixty #7: Bob's Biggest Fan
In this latest Six 4 Sixty, Terry Cook brings together a fresh team of ADI Avengers: Bob Morton, Kim Gibson, Emma Fonnaland, Tommy Sandhu, Stewart Lochrie, and Tom Stenson, for another rapid-fire round of six questions, each answered in 60 seconds.
This episode dives into some of the biggest issues facing driving instructors today, from raising lesson prices with confidence to adapting communication styles, promoting your business as demand slows, and tracking the right metrics for success.
There’s plenty of straight-talking insight on self-reflection, CPD, and the habits that keep instructors sharp, plus an honest look at whether they’d all still choose to be ADIs knowing what the industry’s like now. The conversation ends with powerful reflections on rapport, professionalism, and the importance of not being “a dick on Facebook.” Packed with humour, honesty, and wisdom, this is one of the most engaging Six 4 Sixty sessions yet.
Contact the ADI Avengers here:
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Transcript
The Instructor Podcast with Terry Cook talking with leaders, innovators, experts and game changers.
Speaker B:About what drives them.
Speaker B:Welcome to the Instructor Podcast.
Speaker B:This is a show that helps you become an even more awesome driving instructor and run a better driving school.
Speaker B:As always, I am your splendid host, Terry Cook.
Speaker B:I'm delighted to be here, but I'm even more delighted that you have chosen to listen because you.
Speaker B:We are back with a brand new edition of the six for 60.
Speaker B:Now, if you haven't come across a six for 60 before, this is the seventh edition.
Speaker B:And this is where I get six ADI Avengers.
Speaker B:Together we ask six questions and they each get 60 seconds to answer.
Speaker B:And today there were some cracking questions sent in with some even better answers.
Speaker B:So make sure you're listening with a pen and paper to make some notes.
Speaker B:Cause there's loads of stuff that you can Action from today's episode.
Speaker B:But just before we dive in, let me introduce you to the Instructor Podcast Premium, your constant CPD companion.
Speaker B:It's crafted to keep you growing and ahead of the curve with exclusive insights and actionable tips.
Speaker B:And the best part, it's always there when you need it.
Speaker B:In your car, in your pocket and in your ears.
Speaker B:Now don't miss out on transforming your teaching and joining a community of dedicated instructors.
Speaker B:Check it out today by going to the Show Notes where you'll find a direct link or go to the website patreon.com forward/the instructor.
Speaker B:But for now, enjoy the episode.
Speaker B:So we are now joined by a fresh cohort of ADI Avengers.
Speaker B:And I'm delighted to welcome you guys in.
Speaker B:And we're going to go around one at a time and introduce them all by way of my favorite part of this entire show, which is a no context question.
Speaker B:So I'll ask them a question and they are not allowed to provide any explanation or context around it.
Speaker B:And today's question is Audit.
Speaker B:Should we keep it?
Speaker B:Should we scrap it?
Speaker B:Or should we change it?
Speaker B:So those are your options or potentially, if you've got a better one, you can chuck your own in.
Speaker B:But we're going to be starting off with Stuart Lochrie on this one, the Scottish hand solo.
Speaker B:So, Stuart, audit.
Speaker B:Keep it, Scrap it or change it.
Speaker C:Keep it, Keep it.
Speaker B:Next up, we have got the man who has won more awards than the entire industry put together and that is Tommy Sandu.
Speaker B:Tommy, odd it.
Speaker B:Keep it, Scrap it or change it.
Speaker D:I think we need to change it.
Speaker B:Change it.
Speaker B:Next up, we are joined by.
Speaker B:So I should have said this.
Speaker B:Tommy is making his instructor podcast debut, but we've also got Kim Gibson making her instructor podcast.
Speaker B:Well, the 6 for 60 debut, definitely.
Speaker B:And I should let this slip that Tom said earlier on that Yorkie's favorite.
Speaker B:But you know, whatever, maybe I shouldn't say that.
Speaker E:I agree.
Speaker B:Keep it, Scrap it or change it, Kim.
Speaker E:Definitely keep it.
Speaker B:Okey dokey.
Speaker B:We have also got one of the originals, one of the OGs.
Speaker B:We are joined by the man who needs no introduction, the man we simply refer to as Bob.
Speaker B:Bob.
Speaker B:Keep it, change it or scrap it.
Speaker A:Change it if it's.
Speaker A:Sorry if it doesn't stay in its original form.
Speaker A:But I liked what it was when it was launched, so I'd love to see that again.
Speaker A:So dbsa, get your chuffing finger out.
Speaker B:I should have reiterated no context on this one, Bob, but whatever, we'll move on.
Speaker A:Was that context?
Speaker B:I would say that is explanation and.
Speaker C:More than one word.
Speaker B:But we move on subtly to the Emma.
Speaker B:Emma Fonnerland, AKA Norwegian Emma.
Speaker B:My second favorite Norwegian Emma.
Speaker B:Order.
Speaker B:Keep it, Scrap it or Change it.
Speaker B:Change it, change it.
Speaker B:And last but by no means least, the person who is currently receiving more voice notes than me than anyone else, Mr. Tom Stenson.
Speaker B:Keep, scrap or change.
Speaker D:Keep.
Speaker B:Interesting.
Speaker B:I like those.
Speaker B:I'm going to go back and relist them, I think, to see who, because I've forgotten, but I like that.
Speaker B:But we're going to get onto the meat of this episode now because we got loads of questions for this.
Speaker B:I've got some of mine, I got some off chatgpt.
Speaker B:There was some sentiment.
Speaker B:I know some really, really good ones on Facebook and if I'm being honest, I think I'm gonna have to do some with these questions because there were some really good questions on there, including one from Lee Jowett who said simply, Lee or Mick, which I'm not going to ask you today.
Speaker B:Maybe I'll ask you when, when I stop recording.
Speaker B:We'll see.
Speaker B:But we're going to go into question number one, which is if you were raising prices and a pupil questioned you on this, how would you justify it?
Speaker B:So we're going to start with you again on this one, Stuart.
Speaker B:If you were raising prices and a pupil questioned you, how would you justify it?
Speaker C:Car insurance prices, website hosting prices, mobile phone, monthly payments, fuel price rises, energy bill rises, cost of professional CPD and amazing Driving Instructor association subscription fees, mortgage and rent increases, cost of food at the supermarket, and if none of that does it, I would then offer to give them the number of the guy down the road who was cheaper.
Speaker C:I think that we shouldn't be embarrassed about raising our prices, given that inflation sends prices of most things up every year.
Speaker C:As long as we're not ripping people off by putting our prices up by, I don't know, £25 an hour or something like that.
Speaker C:I'm also.
Speaker C:How long have we got left?
Speaker C:10 seconds.
Speaker C:I think also we should consider things like flexible pricing.
Speaker C:If somebody wants us to go and work on a Saturday morning, we should charge higher for that kind of thing as well.
Speaker C:So, no, we shouldn't be embarrassed by it.
Speaker B:Okay, I like it.
Speaker B:A nice comprehensive answer.
Speaker C:We're coming to you next.
Speaker B:Tommy, same question.
Speaker B:If you're raising prices and a pupil questions you on this, how would you justify it?
Speaker D:I think what Stuart said is totally be honest with them first.
Speaker D:You know, we need to raise our prices because the cost of living goes up.
Speaker D:And that's the most important thing, the honesty of it all.
Speaker D:Why are we doing it?
Speaker D:How are we doing it, when are we doing it?
Speaker D:And then I suppose the value.
Speaker D:If they get value for money, they're not going.
Speaker D:They're going to understand that.
Speaker D:They're going to see that.
Speaker D:And, you know, if you ask them, the other question is, do you get an increase every year or every month or whatever it might be?
Speaker D:And that's really, really important as well.
Speaker D:And like Stuart says, flexibility, you know, if you're working out of hours, weekends, evening, why should we not charge more?
Speaker D:You know, do people get paid overtime?
Speaker D:Do we get overpaid time?
Speaker D:So it's them kind of things that, you know, the people.
Speaker D:And people respect that.
Speaker D:If you tell them honestly, most people respect you and say, you know what, that's a fair comment and I'll agree with it.
Speaker B:Good stuff.
Speaker B:Next up, him.
Speaker B:How would you justify that price increase?
Speaker E:Like that's been said, really, is the cost of living is going up.
Speaker E:Um, therefore our prices do need to go up.
Speaker E:Um, you know, you could talk about what you offer as a service and what they're getting for that service to justify it.
Speaker E:Um, I personally don't increase prices halfway through lessons.
Speaker E:So I would then from this day onwards, anybody new that signs up with me from that point onwards, they would go with my new prices and my existing pupils would stay at the existing price.
Speaker E:Um, even to the point if somebody inquired a couple of weeks back and the new prices come into force, I will honor the price that I originally quoted when we inquired about lessons.
Speaker E:So, yeah, I tend not to put prices up halfway through some of these training sessions with me.
Speaker E:But as we have already said, you Know, there's a.
Speaker E:There's reasons for it.
Speaker E:And you can justify it by explaining, you know, the service you're offering and the cost of living.
Speaker E:That's going up too.
Speaker B:I may have forgot to put the timer upon that one, but I think it was in six seconds.
Speaker B:So we'll go through it.
Speaker B:Bob, same question to you.
Speaker A:Well, as well as everything that's already being said as part of my contracting with anybody that I work with, we have the conversation at the start.
Speaker A:How's it going to work?
Speaker A:What happens if you're late?
Speaker A:What happens if I'm late?
Speaker A:We go through the terms and conditions.
Speaker A:I would also explain at that point that from time to time, price reviews will be undertaken and all of the things that Stuart talked about would be taken into account and they would get advance notice of it.
Speaker A:So it's.
Speaker A:I'm never going to spring it on and say, well, I'm putting it up like an elopement kind of thing.
Speaker A:It's, well, okay.
Speaker A:And the next price review, these are the things that I'm taking into consideration.
Speaker A:And after that, this is what I've decided upon.
Speaker A:I would then have that conversation with them.
Speaker A:Are you still happy to continue?
Speaker A:And it's a yes or no.
Speaker B:Contracting is the secret to everything contracting.
Speaker B:Emma, you're up next.
Speaker F:This is coming from someone who has never raised for prices, because I dread it.
Speaker F:Um, but I think if I did, I would probably just do it for new learners.
Speaker F:And how I would justify it is they've chosen me for a reason.
Speaker F:And they've chosen me because I am good at what I do and I want to be good at what I do.
Speaker F:And I really would use that as a selling point.
Speaker F:I put a lot of money and effort into my own development and hopefully that's why they've chosen me.
Speaker F:And I hope that that would make them want to continue to stay with me.
Speaker B:You realize that we're all going to be messaging you for the rest of the year, not just asking a requesting, but demanding that you increase your prices.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker F:Oh, God.
Speaker D:Including Bob.
Speaker B:In fact, I'm setting Bob this mission.
Speaker F:Oh, God.
Speaker F:Okay, I'll do it.
Speaker B:I think we found a new trick.
Speaker B:Sorry.
Speaker B:So last up, Tom Stenson.
Speaker B:If you're raising prices and pupils question you, how would you justify it?
Speaker G:I justify by saying, I know Terry Cook.
Speaker G:Other than what's already been said, I think if it was a new learner, I would justify it by kind of explaining how I deliver lessons and what the benefits are.
Speaker G:Look at reviews.
Speaker G:Obviously, I never post any Bad reviews like nobody does.
Speaker G:If it were existing learners, I would hope that they are already happy with the quality of lesson that they're already receiving and so increasing that price wouldn't be an issue for them.
Speaker B:If you do recommend or mention Terry Cut, just mention the Five Minute Theory podcast as well.
Speaker B:They'll like that.
Speaker B:But also bad reviews.
Speaker B:I love sharing bad reviews.
Speaker B:Or at least bad comments get so much better interaction.
Speaker B:Anyway, let's move on to question number two, which is how do you adapt your communication style to suit different learners?
Speaker B:And how did you know it needed adapting?
Speaker B:Now this was set in by Emma Cossington, who was a regular on the 660, but thankfully not here today.
Speaker B:So I don't have to refer to people as Norwegian Emma and Scoussemma, which I may have got told off for last time.
Speaker B:But Tommy, we're going to be starting with you on this one first.
Speaker B:How do you adapt your communication style suit different learners?
Speaker B:And how did you know it needed adapting?
Speaker D:Okay, I think the easiest way to learn if something's not going is it's probably facial expressions.
Speaker D:The way the learner is kind of looking at you, kind of.
Speaker D:And then the next question I think is easy one is to say, what have you learned?
Speaker D:What have you understood?
Speaker D:And if they haven't understood something, then it's quite evident there's a problem there.
Speaker D:And then you've got to adapt it.
Speaker D:Now I've being bilingual sometimes can use a secondary language and that helps me because I can then adapt in a totally diverse way to most people.
Speaker D:But it may be that you have to demo something.
Speaker D:You may have to write it down for them, but you have to change that style of the way you've taught them the first way.
Speaker D:And perhaps ask them as well, what do you, how would you prefer me to tell you?
Speaker D:Because that would be a really good way for them to understand what they kind of the way they learn and how they do it.
Speaker B:Curiosity Tommy, what languages do you speak?
Speaker D:Oh, I speak Hindi, Punjabi and Urdu and English.
Speaker B:So much respect for people that speak multiple languages because I still struggle with English.
Speaker D:So do I.
Speaker B:Anyway, next up on this we've got Kim.
Speaker B:How do you adapt your communication style to suit different learners?
Speaker B:And how did you know it needed adapting?
Speaker E:First of all, knowing that it needs adapting.
Speaker E:As Tommy said, facial expressions will say a lot.
Speaker E:If they ask you to repeat that maybe while you're driving and you're talking and they say, oh, can you tell me that again, it's clear possibly that they haven't registered that conversation.
Speaker E:So then adapting, possibly by moving, pulling up to the side of the road and repeating what you said, using visual aids if you need to, to help communicate the message that you're trying to get across would be a good way as well.
Speaker E:But the open questions, you know, do you have any questions on anything I've said or maybe asking questions to get feedback back from what you said to make sure it has registered so that they are able then to respond to your question to give you the feedback that they've understood what you said.
Speaker B:I love a good open question.
Speaker B:We're going to you next on this, Bob.
Speaker A:No surprise, I'm going to say contracting again.
Speaker A:And the reason that I say that is because for years I dealt with complaints in ldc.
Speaker A:I don't get a lot, but there's enough.
Speaker A:And the contracting was designed really to prevent issues.
Speaker A:So it's a case of saying to somebody at the outset, look, it's important for me that we wrap the learning around you.
Speaker A:In order to do that successfully, I'm going to have to ask you how it works, but also relating to what Tommy had said, looking at the non verbals, also active listening, you know, did you understand that?
Speaker A:Yeah, I think so.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:So we don't know so, so I would delve into that.
Speaker A:So it's simple questions regularly.
Speaker A:What did you like, what did you not like?
Speaker A:Were you surprised by anything in a good way, in a bad way?
Speaker A:And if we were doing it again, would you do it differently?
Speaker A:If so, how?
Speaker A:What do you need from me as well as what do I need from you?
Speaker A:So it's that two way conversation all the time.
Speaker B:Ms. Fonnelland, how do you adapt your communication style and how do you know it needs adapting?
Speaker F:I think it starts with the report that you build with learners.
Speaker F:I think it's really, really important to have good rapport and to continue sort of doing check and sort of chunking things in bop, like making it into like little chunks, making sure that you are listening, making sure that you're actively looking for clues and sometimes the learner you normally have isn't the learner that shows up on the day.
Speaker F:And I think that that's really, really important to accept and look for so that we're able to help them whatever they show up like on that day.
Speaker B:I think I'm going to try and get Emma on Bob on every episode going forward.
Speaker B:Tom, you're up next.
Speaker G:Two things I'd recover what Emma said rapport I think is the first one and then second feedback, feedback from them for me.
Speaker G:So I know that what I'm doing is helping them in a positive way.
Speaker G:I think that then is underpinned by that rapport.
Speaker G:If we haven't got that, that feedback is going to be harder to sort of receive.
Speaker B:And then.
Speaker B:Stuart, what are your thoughts on this?
Speaker C:Yeah, I heard rapport as well.
Speaker C:I don't think I overthink this too much.
Speaker C:And I don't think of it probably as communication style.
Speaker C:Uh, when I saw Emma's question, I was thinking, do I change my communication style?
Speaker C:I. I probably think of it as just changing my tactics a little bit in terms of how I'm working with someone.
Speaker C:Um, if I don't have rapport with someone, natural rapport, and I find them a little bit quiet, for example, then my key tactic is to get them to take responsibility as quickly as possible.
Speaker C:Because I definitely do not want to be in a situation where I'm telling someone what to do when I don't have rapport with them.
Speaker C:That's.
Speaker C:That's just a recipe for disaster.
Speaker C:So I think it's about, for me, it's about being aware of the rapport and if it's not there, then I need to do what I was probably going to do anyway, which is get them to take responsibility.
Speaker C:If it's something in particular that, you know, really specific with a pdi, for example, that they're not getting, I can absolutely go to a demo or I can just have a different kind of.
Speaker B:Coaching conversation first to hit the timer today.
Speaker B:I like it.
Speaker B:One of the things I love about doing these, when we've got six youth on, I like the nodding heads.
Speaker B:You know, when someone gives an answer and then you've got five other people just nodding along and just in agreement, I really like it.
Speaker B:All right, let's move on to question number three.
Speaker B:We're going to be starting with you with this one, Kim.
Speaker B:And this one is sent in by 6 for 60 original Phil Cowley, who asked the question, with pupil supply and demand starting to show signs of slowing, what's the one best thing you've done to promote yourself?
Speaker B:Take it away, Kim.
Speaker E:I think my Google page, having a Google page, it was the first best thing that I ever did.
Speaker E:As soon as I'm liaising with a pupil, referring them to that for reviews, posting on that, some past pictures.
Speaker E:Anybody that wants to search for a local driving instructor will use Google.
Speaker E:And that tends to be where I'm quite visible within the community.
Speaker E:But also, um, a lot of referrals come from that just People that don't know me and not referred from previous students, being able to be on Google and see genuine reviews from other people that have passed with me or trained with me, um, it's the best place that I think that I've actually promoted myself or used to promote myself over the years of being a driving instructor.
Speaker E:So with pupil demand slowing a little bit, I know that with such a good Google page, I'm probably going to get quite a good referral.
Speaker E:Quite a lot of people still contacting me.
Speaker B:We've got one for Google.
Speaker B:Bob, what's the best thing you've done to promote yourselves?
Speaker A:I think the key thing, you know, the best resource we've got at our disposal is our existing pupil base.
Speaker A:So if we're really successful with them, if we really do wrap ourselves around them and they're not only learning to drive, but they're enjoying the experience and growing within it, then it's the easiest thing in the world when the next government that cocks it up, cocks it up and we end up in a recession.
Speaker A:To use your existing pupils to get you new ones, they're your best advocate, I think.
Speaker B:Emma, what about you?
Speaker F:To be honest, I'm not very good at promoting myself and it's something that I need to work on, but I like to think that the way I promote myself is how I do my work.
Speaker F:Like, I really do care about the job and the quality that I deliver and I think that because I do that and because I'm like, on always talking about road safety and stuff, that people who care about that will naturally gravitate towards me and hopefully it will get some good word of mouth going.
Speaker F:But I need to get better at promoting myself.
Speaker F:I'm not good at it.
Speaker B:Well, to be fair, you had a very similar answer to Bob, so, you know, there you go.
Speaker B:This is going to be my ongoing job for the entire episode.
Speaker B:I apologize in advance.
Speaker B:Tom, what's the one best thing you've done to promote yourself?
Speaker G:Become friends with Terry Cook.
Speaker B:Yes, I was waiting for someone to give the answer.
Speaker G:Do I get commission?
Speaker G:What's the one best thing I've done to promote myself?
Speaker G:I suppose I'd just reiterate what Bob and Emma have said, really, and that is try and be good at what I do, because then you don't have to promote yourself.
Speaker G:Other people promote you for you, if that was made sense, would say so.
Speaker B:But you do get bonus points, so that's good.
Speaker B:Stuart, what's your one thing you've done.
Speaker C:To promote yourself so first of all, I think this is an excellent question and I think it's worth mentioning that if you don't know this already, the people who are listening to this, that the supply of driving instructors is probably going to outstrip demand because there are 43,000 on the register and 1,700 people applying to be a driving instructor every month.
Speaker C:So for me, it's quality.
Speaker C:I own a driving school, as Tommy does and as Tom and Kim do, and for me is quality.
Speaker C:And that comes down to things like, how good is your website?
Speaker C:Please don't go look at my website because I'm building a new one at the moment.
Speaker C:On the back of this, if you're taking photos of your past pupils, get a really good camera, or if you don't have a really good one on your phone already, make sure you get a really good one and that it stands out in terms of quality.
Speaker C:How are you presenting for your pupils?
Speaker C:Are you clean?
Speaker C:Are you presentable?
Speaker C:Have you got branded clothing?
Speaker C:All this stuff makes a difference and it's really easy.
Speaker C:It doesn't have to cost a lot of money.
Speaker C:But I think the marketplace is going to become really stowed out and I think quality and first impressions are going to matter a lot.
Speaker B:Perfect timing.
Speaker B:That was impressive.
Speaker B:You're on fire tonight, Stuart.
Speaker B:Do you know what?
Speaker B:A little giveaway.
Speaker B:One of my secrets.
Speaker B:I don't want to do this, but because you mentioned pictures earlier on this year, I started taking Polaroids and I would send the Polaroids to the student after they pass and their mum puts it on the fridge.
Speaker B:And I found that I've had people that have contacted me because they've been at the parents house and gone, oh, I've seen that.
Speaker B:Rather than just go through a social media, not the biggest thing, but somewhere a little bit different.
Speaker B:So there you go.
Speaker C:Worth mentioning.
Speaker C:Sorry to come back to that, but Laura Joyce, Laura Joyce said if you.
Speaker C:If you take a selfie, then people are more likely to look at a photo if there's two people in it, rather than just somebody standing at a car.
Speaker C:I thought that's a really good tip.
Speaker B:I really hope I haven't just stolen your answer there, Tommy, but we'll find out.
Speaker C:Take it away.
Speaker D:I think for us it's.
Speaker D:We've been around for a long time and we've kind of created a trusted brand, so we've kind of got along that kind of like, you know, why come to us?
Speaker D:Why trust us?
Speaker D:Because we've been around and everything else, and what we do is we work with the local.
Speaker D:Other businesses that are local to us.
Speaker D:So we've created like a loyalty card, a privileged card where we can share discounted rates.
Speaker D:So if you're having lessons with us and you're going down the dessert shop, you get 10% off and, you know, X, Y, Z.
Speaker D:And that creates that community.
Speaker D:It creates a kind of a different style of approach and it kind of, it really does bring your brand out because everyone does a Google, everyone does the pictures, but we've got to do something different, like Stuart says, to make us stand out of the crowd.
Speaker D:And the trusted brand has really kind of, you know, people have really looked at that and took that on board like that.
Speaker B:To anyone listening to this, that is slightly worried about customers drying up, you've got some good options there.
Speaker B:So you probably noticed a theme running through today's episode.
Speaker B:Every one of these awesome instructors have talked about reflection, communication and constantly improving what they do.
Speaker B:And that's exactly what the instructor podcast Premium is all about.
Speaker B:It's your constant companion for your development.
Speaker B:It's there for the full journey, not just the start.
Speaker B:So inside of Premium, you'll find expert sessions, coaching conversations and practical tools that help you raise your game in every area, whether that's managing prices, improving communication or finding new ways to stand out as a professional.
Speaker B:We're not here for quick fixes or tick box cpd.
Speaker B:We're here to grow together, to share ideas and make sure you've got the support you need every step of the way.
Speaker B:So if you're ready to go beyond the test and become part of a community of instructors who are genuinely raising standards, you'll find the link in the show notes or head to patreon.com forward/inventor and join today, your constant companion in your pocket, in your car and in your ears.
Speaker B:Let's move on to question number four, which is, we're going to be starting with you on this one, Bob.
Speaker B:So question number four.
Speaker B:What's one metric every instructor should check regularly and why.
Speaker B:So what's one metric every instructor should check regularly and why take it away?
Speaker A:We should check whether our customers are happy.
Speaker A:Why?
Speaker A:Because if you don't, they'll bugger off.
Speaker B:Like it?
Speaker B:We're leaving it there.
Speaker A:Yeah, that's it.
Speaker B:I'll take that as a win.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:The best things are always the simplest.
Speaker B:You need.
Speaker A:Not early if they're not happy.
Speaker B:Emma, what's one metric every instructor should check regularly and why feel so silly?
Speaker F:And I'm going to put it down to the fact that, you know, I'M an immigrant.
Speaker F:I was thinking like oils and tires, like make sure that they're like up to scratch.
Speaker F:But yeah, I would, I would say that it's important to check in with, with your customers, making sure that they are showing up for their lessons, making sure that you do ask for and that you're open for feedback, even when that isn't necessarily like, you know, you're the best.
Speaker F:And I think that's really where the gold lies, is then you can use it to get better.
Speaker B:Think I'm going to put it down to the fact that I'm an immigrant.
Speaker B:Maybe my favorite ever line on the 6 for 60 and I'm not 100% sure why language is hard.
Speaker F:Okay.
Speaker B:But I liked it.
Speaker B:And I will say there is not a flagging site on this podcast.
Speaker B:It's not a flagging site.
Speaker B:So we're all good.
Speaker B:And I've completely lost my bearings.
Speaker B:That's completely from Tom, I think.
Speaker B:Next, and I think we're answering the question, what's one metric every instructor should check regularly and why?
Speaker G:How often they've spoken to Terry Cook this week?
Speaker G:I think one metric that every instructor should be mindful of and looking for is how well are their learners doing post test?
Speaker G:Are they, have they had collisions?
Speaker G:Have they had near misses?
Speaker G:Is there anything else we could do to try and help them post test?
Speaker B:Oh, I like it.
Speaker B:I like a bit of post test stuff.
Speaker B:Stuart, what's your metric?
Speaker C:Yourself.
Speaker C:The one thing you should check every day or every week is yourself.
Speaker C:So are you right now the best version of yourself that you want to be?
Speaker C:Are you enjoying what you're doing?
Speaker C:And if not, why not?
Speaker C:You need to find out why are you giving the best you can on every single driving list?
Speaker C:And I don't mean 10 out of 10, but are you giving the best that you can on that particular day?
Speaker C:If not, why not?
Speaker C:All the other stuff that you're living in life, you're living your life in line with your values.
Speaker C:If not, why not?
Speaker C:If not, where do you want to be?
Speaker C:If you're not there just now, where do you want to be and how are you going to get there?
Speaker C:All these coaching questions that we know work.
Speaker C:If you're not at your best and you're not where you want to be, that's going to come across in your lessons.
Speaker C:And all the stuff that we've talked about already in terms of quality and reputation and branding is not going to matter because that's going to impact all of that.
Speaker C:Everything depends on you.
Speaker C:And to Borrow a line from James Hetfield, nothing else matters.
Speaker C:Everything depends on you.
Speaker B:Excellent.
Speaker B:And Tommy, what's your metric?
Speaker D:I think he's a combination of what Stuart said and some of the other studies that pupil satisfaction or instructor satisfaction, you know, are they satisfied with what you do?
Speaker D:And it's easy for us to ask a learner in the car, oh, are you happy with what we've done and everything else?
Speaker D:They're never going to say no, are they?
Speaker D:So the question is, how do we get a third person to do that for us?
Speaker D:Obviously, we've got an office, so I'd be able to do that regularly.
Speaker D:And that's a real proper sensor check, because when that pupil can then talk to that third person, they'll be honest.
Speaker D:And that feedback is quite important to you because you'll really understand if you're delivering that lesson to the right level.
Speaker D:And like Stuart said, is there any concerns with the instructors?
Speaker D:Is there any issues or, you know, things that are going on outside of that spectrum that we can help with?
Speaker B:Excellent.
Speaker B:So, so far I've been really happy with all the advances, so let's hope that Kim doesn't let me down.
Speaker E:I'm sorry, I'm going to.
Speaker E:Mine's going to be the diary.
Speaker E:I think your diary, checking your diary regularly is a big thing for me.
Speaker E:One, making time for yourself, your own mental health and wellbeing.
Speaker E:Are you working too much?
Speaker E:Take some time off, book a holiday?
Speaker E:I definitely think you need to think about your wellbeing.
Speaker E:Then also, have you got a full diary?
Speaker E:Have you got all your lessons filled?
Speaker E:If not, what are we doing wrong?
Speaker E:Are we providing the right service?
Speaker E:Do we need to do something different to get those referrals, to get those gaps filled in?
Speaker E:Then also thinking that obviously learners are test focused, that's their end goal.
Speaker E:At the end of the day, are we giving them the time that they need?
Speaker E:You know, are we leading up to their test?
Speaker E:Do we need to allow more time for that?
Speaker E:Maybe drop a learner off that is not ready for their theory, you know, put some time in for that.
Speaker E:The student is going to possibly want your time, but I think if you focus on your diary, all of those things should come work into place and you should be running quite a good business.
Speaker B:Most certainly did not let me down.
Speaker B:I love that answer, genuinely.
Speaker B:And I love all six of those answers, even the one about checking the ties and stuff.
Speaker B:I love all those answers and I am so pleased.
Speaker B:No one said pass rate.
Speaker B:No one said pass rate.
Speaker B:We've got, like, the chair of the njc, we've got Tommy Sanders.
Speaker B:Like I'm not going to listen.
Speaker B:We've got all these people on here and no one said pass rate.
Speaker B:So anyone listening?
Speaker B:Not to ignore it, but techno of that.
Speaker B:So we are gonna be starting with you this time, Emma.
Speaker B:Well, do you still throw me from last one?
Speaker B:What's a daily habit that can help instructors stay sharp?
Speaker F:I think that something that none of us probably are good enough at is drinking water.
Speaker F:And I think that's really important.
Speaker F:Make sure that you hydrate.
Speaker F:Another thing that I do.
Speaker F:I know you guys are dog people, but I have my beloved firstborn son, my cat and I. Yeah, I require cuddles every day before a working day and that helps me stay sharp.
Speaker B:Water and cuddles, that's good.
Speaker B:Next up we've got Tom.
Speaker B:What's a daily habit that can help instructors any.
Speaker B:Any uptake on water or cuddles?
Speaker B:What are you adding?
Speaker G:Speaking to Terry Cook.
Speaker B:You're my MVP today.
Speaker G:Yeah, I mean that, that's good.
Speaker G:I'm gonna link it back to sort of what Stuart said earlier and that's kind of focusing on us.
Speaker G:It sometimes can be a very lonely job and being able to focus on our own time.
Speaker G:For me that is spending time with my dog.
Speaker G:Sorry, Emma.
Speaker G:Oh, and my wife.
Speaker G:But yeah, looking after ourselves is obviously very important.
Speaker B:I mean, I'm happy I'm on there, but Ziggy should definitely be above me.
Speaker B:I am going to make a montage of all your answers, by the way.
Speaker B:So next, Stuart, any.
Speaker B:Any addition to what's been said so far regarding a daily habit that can help instructors stay sharp?
Speaker C:This is a very quick one.
Speaker C:I mean, I think coffee is absolutely essential for everyone.
Speaker C:If you're not drinking coffee, I'm sorry, you're not on top of your game.
Speaker C:It's just impossible.
Speaker C:If you don't drink coffee, start drinking it.
Speaker C:But I think also checking your weekly to do list.
Speaker C:So you know, if you need to know for me, writing down what I'm going to do this week and then I need to check that every day to see if I'm on track.
Speaker C:So just accountability.
Speaker C:Am I on track?
Speaker C:You remember how you felt at the start of the week when you review your list halfway through.
Speaker C:And then also more coffee.
Speaker B:How do you take your coffee, Stuart?
Speaker C:Black?
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:After my own heart.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:None of this milk nonsense.
Speaker B:Okay, so I lost my track again.
Speaker B:Tommy, you're up next.
Speaker B:What's a daily habit?
Speaker D:I think it's self reflection.
Speaker D:I think to me it's A case of having that time away from the car, away from your pupils, wherever it may be, the gym, the park, or wherever that you can do some self reflection and just kind of understand where are you do diptych, you know, check yourself, um, make sure you're comfortable in your own skin and everything else.
Speaker D:Cause that's like we say we go out, we do lessons.
Speaker D:We don't even know half a time where we are or what we're doing because there's so many things going on, people's heads with different things and everything else.
Speaker D:And the other thing is probably for me is cpd, you know, we don't do enough of it.
Speaker D:So then what happens?
Speaker D:We feel that are we on our game or aren't we on our game?
Speaker D:Um, and then we hear all these posts and everything else that people panic and think, oh, hang on, am I actually doing the job right or am I doing it wrong?
Speaker D:So I think it's, you know, reflection and CPD for me.
Speaker B:I love the idea of daily cpd and thinking about how many instructors do annual cpd.
Speaker B:Can't convert them to daily would be fun.
Speaker B:All right, next up we have Kim.
Speaker E:So I was gonna say reflection or cpd, but as Tommy's just gone before me, I'm gonna say go for a walk.
Speaker E:I think that that's one of the best things that you can do to clear your head after a long day.
Speaker E:Yes, you can reflect during that time, but I find that we sit in a car for a really long time.
Speaker E:We don't move enough.
Speaker E:Going out for that little stroll at the end of a working day or.
Speaker E:Or before the working day.
Speaker E:For those of you with dogs, that probably works great for you, but I don't have a dog, so I've got to force myself to go out and just get that little bit of exercise.
Speaker E:And it does get you away from the car for a bit because there has been weeks where I've kind of sat there and thought, I haven't done any steps at all this week.
Speaker E:So I think just finding time to go for a walk, you can do your reflection during that time and you can just like clear your head space too.
Speaker B:Another crappy answer and a top tip from me.
Speaker B:If you go for a walk, take a selfie with a cow, they get an awful lot of social media interaction.
Speaker B:So, yeah, two birds are.
Speaker E:I've actually got quite a few of me and cows, Terry.
Speaker E:I must share them with you one day.
Speaker C:Wait.
Speaker B:Yes, Cows are awesome.
Speaker B:Bob, what's your habit?
Speaker A:Well, it's sort of Evolved from, you know, being director of training at LDC and the work that I do now.
Speaker A:I often work with people now who tell me that they've lost their mojo.
Speaker A:You know, they don't love the job the way they used to do in the past.
Speaker A:So we always have a look at, well, how are you doing the job is this, is it giving you.
Speaker A:And it touches on what everybody said.
Speaker A:Is it bringing you what you need for a lot of people?
Speaker A:You know, if you're, if you're a young instructor, you've worked a hard day at work and you're going home to a house full of toddlers, you probably need five minutes quiet time in the car on your own before you go in.
Speaker A:So it's examining, is it giving you what you want from life and from the universe?
Speaker A:I have to check myself regularly because I'm my own worst enemy.
Speaker B:I'm.
Speaker A:I'm semi retired now, so I've got to really make sure I don't load my diary up because I'm too soft.
Speaker A:I like to say yes all the time.
Speaker A:So it's just checking that the job's giving you what you want.
Speaker B:I'm interested that you finally admitted you're not fully retired and you're now owning that you're semi retired.
Speaker B:But do you know, I've loved all the answers to you, but that question in particular, I think there's some really awesome answer in there.
Speaker B:And anyone listening, I would suggest rewind, gee, because that's my age, go back and listen to that again and find one or two things from that you can add into your day, maybe excluding the Talk to me 1.
Speaker B:But yeah, it's really good answer.
Speaker B:So let's move on to question number six.
Speaker B:So we will be starting with you on this one, Tom, and this is sent in by Penny Alexander.
Speaker B:So that is good that you're starting with you.
Speaker B:So if you knew what the industry would be like now when you first started, would you still become an adi?
Speaker B:And I love that Penny put this.
Speaker B:Please explain the reasons for your answer.
Speaker B:So if you knew what the industry would be like now when you first died, would you still be coming at adi?
Speaker B:Take it away.
Speaker G:If I knew that the industry would have Terry Cook in it, of course I would become a driving instructor.
Speaker G:You won't believe how long it took me to come up with these.
Speaker G:Do you know, I kind of resonate with this because I came into this industry 14 and a half, 14 years ago, not planning to stay in it for 14 years.
Speaker G:It was just a stopgap so knowing what it is now and the good that the likes of us can do, yes, I jump at the chance.
Speaker G:And those people out there who are thinking of becoming an instructor, if you are doing it for the right reasons, there's plenty of people out there that will help you.
Speaker B:What, Stuart?
Speaker C:100%.
Speaker C:100%.
Speaker C:And I say that with the.
Speaker C:I don't know if it's a caveat or it does support it.
Speaker C:I was rubbish.
Speaker C:For the first three years of my green badge, I was a terrible driving ashoka.
Speaker C:And I think part of the reason I was a terrible driving instructor was because I became a driving instructor to pay my bills.
Speaker C:That's nothing against anyone who does that.
Speaker C:For me, it was a job.
Speaker C:I was made redundant from a well paying job and I had a mortgage to pay and I had to get earning money very, very quickly.
Speaker C:So it didn't occur to me that anything like this existed.
Speaker C:And when I came across coaching in the industry, that changed everything for me because suddenly it became about people becoming the best versions of themselves, including me.
Speaker C:And now, do you know, imagine we get to work in an industry where we can teach young people how to set goals and assess their own performance and reflect.
Speaker C:And what's not brilliant about that?
Speaker C:The industry is far better now than when I joined it.
Speaker C:Unquestionably.
Speaker B:Not to take anything away from your answer, but can you commit to something 100% and then add a caveat?
Speaker B:Oh, look at Mickey Listener.
Speaker C:It wasn't a caveat, it was supporting.
Speaker C:Yeah, everything was rubbish back then, including me.
Speaker B:Tommy, if you knew what the industry would be like now when you first started, would you still become an adi?
Speaker D:Yes, I think for me, I started in this industry by default because I was doing taxi training and everything else and we had to become ADI to do it.
Speaker D:And actually when I became an adi, most people, and still today, people tell you you can't do something and I was always told, you can't do this, you'll never make this, you'll never do that.
Speaker D:And to me, making them barriers, breaking them barriers down, doing all the things I do is the massive achievement I've made in my life.
Speaker D:And it's also shows and inspires other people that are starting the journey that it can be done.
Speaker D:You know, there's no barriers, you can do whatever you want.
Speaker D:And this is, this is probably one of the only industries that you can actually go all over the world and teach and do all sorts of things.
Speaker D:And that's the passion you have.
Speaker D:When somebody passes their test, you think wow.
Speaker D:I've still got it.
Speaker B:So we come into Kim next.
Speaker E:Absolutely, yes, definitely.
Speaker E:I would still do it.
Speaker E:You get the pleasure of teaching somebody a life skill, something that a driving license they're going to have for the rest of their life.
Speaker E:I tried to be an ADI when I was 21.
Speaker E:Obviously I'm only 22 now and obviously it's gone through the stages.
Speaker E:But yeah, I tried several times through the years of doing it.
Speaker E:I even was going to travel to Ireland and was going to train to be an ADI and then decided to stay here and thought, my third time lucky, I'm actually going to do it this time.
Speaker E:Now that I'm doing the job, really, really enjoy it.
Speaker E:I get the pleasure of being my own boss, taking as much time as I want off to go and travel.
Speaker E:And then when I am working, I get to meet totally different people every day and I'm teaching them something that, you know, is something that they're aiming for.
Speaker E:It's a massive goal for them.
Speaker E:I also get the pleasure of working with a really great team of people.
Speaker E:And as much as I'm going to just say drive up there and the people that I work with are brilliant, I'm not just talking about them.
Speaker E:Even when you go to expos and places like that, the extended industry, it's just as amazing.
Speaker E:Got cut off now and you get.
Speaker B:To be Tom's favorite.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:Yeah, okay.
Speaker B:So Bob, would you still do it?
Speaker A:Absolutely.
Speaker A:The job is far superior now.
Speaker A: irst qualified back in Jesus,: Speaker A:You're the issue here.
Speaker A:You're a dummy.
Speaker A:What is it about what I'm saying that you can't understand?
Speaker A:Over a period of time, I've come to realize that, well, actually I wasn't very good then.
Speaker A:It was all about ego and about just come and worship at the feet of the mighty instructor.
Speaker A:The way that I work now makes me happy, you know, and it doesn't matter who's next to me.
Speaker A:I have a hundred percent belief in them.
Speaker A:And if it's not working, it's me that's, that's not performing, not them.
Speaker A:And because of that, it's, it's a wonderful world that we work in.
Speaker A:I mean, you know, aside from all the nonsense that we have around the issues that we have with the dvsa, but that, that doesn't stop my enjoyment of the job at all.
Speaker A:Just Made it.
Speaker B:I've got to say that that line there, the way that I work now makes me happy.
Speaker B:That's my new favorite line.
Speaker B:I think if we can all get to a point where we can say, the way that I work now makes me happy, I think.
Speaker B:I think we're in a good place.
Speaker B:So, final one of the question, Emma Funnelland, would you.
Speaker B:Would you still become an ADI?
Speaker F:Yeah, 100%.
Speaker F:I think that I sort of.
Speaker F:I didn't come into it for the dream that I was told.
Speaker F:It wasn't about the hours, it wasn't about the money.
Speaker F:Like, I've always wanted to make a difference to road safety.
Speaker F:I've always wanted to.
Speaker F:Well, since I've been, you know, cautious, I've wanted to stop people from having to bury their babies.
Speaker F:And I feel like no matter what DBSA throws at me or, you know, no matter what, sometimes learners throw at me, that doesn't change for me.
Speaker F:I always get to go home and feel like I've made a difference, and I wouldn't have that any other way.
Speaker F:I also think I'm incredibly privileged, having come into the industry two and a half years ago.
Speaker F:I've never known any different.
Speaker F:So I never had that where they didn't have waiting times.
Speaker F:I have had the waiting times since day one.
Speaker F:And, you know, it's hard sometimes, but what isn't?
Speaker F:Everything's hard.
Speaker F:I love it.
Speaker B:Some lovely answers there.
Speaker B:That's made me really happy.
Speaker B:But I am going to give anyone a chance to come back and come on anything they've heard or if they want to add anything.
Speaker B:Does anyone want an additional 60 seconds?
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:Excellent, Bob, Go for it.
Speaker A:We all clearly understand what rapport means in terms of coaching, but I think a great deal of instructors think rapport is just getting on with your pupils and telling them jokes and sharing personal experiences and relationship experiences.
Speaker A:That's what some instructors see as rapport.
Speaker A:The reason I know that is because they observe lessons and afterwards say, why are you discussing your relationship or their relationship?
Speaker A:What's that about?
Speaker A:Oh, well, I'm building rapport, aren't they?
Speaker A:No, no, you're just.
Speaker A:You're just.
Speaker A:You're sowing the seed of a complaint is what you're doing because one day you're going to overstep the line and say something they weren't expecting.
Speaker A:So I think as an industry, we need better understanding of what rapport actually is.
Speaker A:It's just the ability to help, have somebody open up and have the right conversations with you.
Speaker A:So you've got to Create the right environment for that to happen.
Speaker B:That is rapport of that.
Speaker B:Does anyone else want 60 seconds or Stuart's there, take it away.
Speaker C:I'm going to add to that, Bob, because I think you're onto something really important, Neil.
Speaker C:I kind of describe it.
Speaker C:You have rapport for customer service and rapport for learning.
Speaker C:And rapport for customer service is still really important because at the end of the day, we want people to like us because we do want them to give us money.
Speaker C:And you do need to get that.
Speaker C:First of all, that's where the professionalism comes in.
Speaker C:In Glasgow, it's called the what team do you support question.
Speaker C:To kind of get that, open up some kind of conversation, that kind of thing.
Speaker C:But rapport for learning, you're absolutely right.
Speaker C:Rapport for learning is completely different because that's where trust comes in.
Speaker C:That's where the understanding around contracting, in terms of getting the point across in some way that you are going to have to do some work here.
Speaker C:This is not an attendance exercise.
Speaker C:You are going to be involved in this process from day one and through contracting.
Speaker C:So the contracting process is just a vital part of that report.
Speaker C:Bang on.
Speaker C:I couldn't agree more.
Speaker A:I think it's something that's missing, is that you see some of the posts on Facebook.
Speaker A:The parent is also part of this because they're probably paying for it.
Speaker C:Absolutely, absolutely.
Speaker A:Yep.
Speaker C:Agreed.
Speaker B:Does Anyone else want 60 seconds to knock that report or anything else?
Speaker B:Oh, here we go.
Speaker B:I've got the immigrant.
Speaker F:Yes.
Speaker F:I would say that I see so much negativity on Facebook and social media and stuff about our industry at the moment and about, you know, work becoming a little less.
Speaker F:I don't know, I'm an immigrant.
Speaker F:I can't think of the word.
Speaker F:But I think that it is such a golden opportunity for everyone to invest in themselves.
Speaker F:Because when the pool of instructors is too big, make sure that you invest time and invest into your own learning and your own development, because that's what's going to make you stand out from that pool.
Speaker F:You don't just want to be a fish, you want to be a shark.
Speaker A:That is something we always talk about, isn't it, Terry?
Speaker A:Don't be a dick on Facebook.
Speaker B:Ian.
Speaker B:Well, don't be a dick generally, but, yes, particularly on Facebook.
Speaker B:But, Emma, you are my second favorite knowledge and so it's all good.
Speaker B:Anyone else want 60 seconds?
Speaker B:Excellent.
Speaker B:In which case, we are going to come to you.
Speaker B:Stuart, you've got a maximum of six seconds.
Speaker B:Tell us why you're awesome.
Speaker C:I'm Scottish.
Speaker C:That's all I need.
Speaker B:I will also take a moment to plug Bright coaching on the adrnjc but you know, you don't have to say that.
Speaker B:It's fine.
Speaker B:Let's move on.
Speaker B:Tommy Sandu, Tommy, you can take more than three seconds if you want.
Speaker B:Why are you awesome?
Speaker D:Why am I awesome?
Speaker D:I don't think I'm awesome.
Speaker D:I'm just human.
Speaker D:I'm just like everybody else.
Speaker D:I try and help everyone, support everyone.
Speaker D:And if we all work together, which we do and we don't vilify people on Facebook and everything else, we will have an awesome industry.
Speaker B:Excellent.
Speaker B:Kim, why are you awesome?
Speaker E:Because I work with a great team of people and not only them, like the driving instructors we work with and even just people that ask for support and help that are not part of our team.
Speaker E:We're all willing to help and support them and I think that's what makes me and Drive up awesome.
Speaker B:Bob, why are you awesome?
Speaker A:Because I've been making mistakes for a shit ton of time and I've learned from them.
Speaker B:My favorite episode ever recorded with you, it was a premium one and it was about the stuff you struggled with and there were so many people that reached out and got in touch, went Bob struggled.
Speaker B:And I think we're guilty of putting people on a pedestal and I think that we're guilty of appearing on a pedestal as well at times.
Speaker B:And I love the fact that that was your answer.
Speaker B:So that's good.
Speaker B:Emma, why are you awesome?
Speaker F:You know, I'm practicing talking about being awesome more and I am awesome because I care and I'm awesome because I really do try to make a difference not just to my learners but to the industry.
Speaker F:And yeah, you guys got to watch out for me because I'm going to make a difference to the industry.
Speaker B:And Tom.
Speaker B:There we go.
Speaker B:Why are you awesome?
Speaker G:I'm awesome by proxy because I'm friends with Terry Cook.
Speaker B:There we go.
Speaker G:But I feel I'm also partly awesome.
Speaker G:Very much for like Kim, I'm very lucky to be part of Drive Up.
Speaker G:I'm very lucky to be part of the NJC and I'm very lucky to be part of Bright coaching and including friends with Terry Cook.
Speaker G:All of those things help.
Speaker B:Well.
Speaker B:Anyone that's enjoyed any from today.
Speaker B:You can find all links for these fine folks in the show notes or the episode workbook if I do one but we'll find out.
Speaker B:But all that's left for me to say is big thank you for you guys come along.
Speaker B:It's been a pleasure.
Speaker E:Thank you for having us.
Speaker B:And that brings us to the end of another cracking 6 for 60.
Speaker B:A massive thank you to my guests Bob Morton, Tim Gibson, Emma Fonneland, Tommy Sandu, Stuart Lockery, and of course Tom Stenson for bringing their honesty, the humor and their hard earned experience to the table.
Speaker B:Now there's some brilliant takeaways in there from being upfront and confident when you raise your prices to adapting your communication so that it lands and keeping your own well being front and center so you can keep giving your best.
Speaker B:Now the line I think that really stuck with me the most was Bob's when he said the way that I work now makes me happy.
Speaker B:Because that's what it's all about, finding the version of this job that works for you.
Speaker B:So if today's episode got you thinking, don't just let that fade into the background noise of your week.
Speaker B:Pick one idea and act on it.
Speaker B:Whether it's reviewing your pricing, tightening your diarrhea, or, you know, drinking more water or going for that walk, it doesn't matter.
Speaker B:Make sure you put it into your week.
Speaker B:And if you want help keeping that momentum going, come and join us inside the Instructor Podcast Premium, your constant companion.
Speaker B:We're there for the full journey, not just the start.
Speaker B:It's packed with expert sessions, coaching calls and practical resources to help you grow your business, your teaching and yourself.
Speaker B:I can find the link in the show notes or at patreon.com forward/inventor.
Speaker B:But until next time, keep learning, keep reflecting, and let's keep raising standards.
Speaker A:The Instructor Podcast with Terry Cook talking with leaders, innovators, experts and game changers.
Speaker B:About what drives them.
